| Posted by: Playin4Keeps at May 12, 2001, 8:33 pm | | Topic: Casinos Using Player Blacklist Forum: Winner Online |
I didn't think CC info was exchanged but the site had this listed as an enticement to join:
Quote:
You can have access to our most up to date black list. It contains, the names, address, email addresses, phone numbers, IP addresses, and credit card numbers of players who play fraudulently or charge back.
You can also submit new players to the black list.
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| Posted by: Playin4Keeps at May 12, 2001, 8:01 pm | | Topic: Casinos Using Player Blacklist Forum: Winner Online |
Quote:
Every month hundreds of thousands of dollars are lost by online casinos as the result of player fraud. The most common scams are credit card based tricks. Scammers wonder from one online casino to another in search of free money. Once their tricks are dedected they move on to defraud another casino.
(I'm sure they meant wander not wonder)
The part about who they target that concerns me the most is this
Quote:
Scammers wonder from one online casino to another in search of free money.
Now if you happen to like to try a lot of different online casino's then the OCMA feels that you now fall into their definition of a scammer. By that definition you can now become part of the list they send out daily.
They may have started out as a way to combat the problem of charge backs but had redefined their mission as to who they wanted to weed out as player's.
There is just way to much potential for "abuse" when this type of act... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: The Original Mary at May 12, 2001, 5:28 pm | | Topic: Casinos Using Player Blacklist Forum: Winner Online |
Dear Casino Owner--
is this the company you want to trade player blacklist info with?
Looks like they ought to be on it. This makes my brain hurt. Can we put them in a ring with Unified Gaming (the anti-robot people) and see who comes out alive?
From www.beejack.com:
"Frequently Asked Questions
Question: What's the difference between Blackjack 2021 and all the other analyzers?
Answer: All other so-called "analyzers" give you answers according to known counting methods (which are not always accurate). Blackjack 2021 uses a mathematical engine that gives you the best move for any given situation of the deck.
Question: If your program is so good why don't you gamble with it, instead of selling it?
Answer: We do.
Question: How can I use Blackjack 2021 in Casinos on the Internet?
Answer: First you run Blackjack 2021, then you put it in the background. While playing in the Casino, you play according to what Bl... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: The Original Mary at May 12, 2001, 4:40 pm | | Topic: Casinos Using Player Blacklist Forum: Winner Online |
It has also been reported that this list contains user information such as name,addresses, and credit card numbers--so instead of serving to protect casinos, this list could easily be one-stop shopping for identity thieves who've registered a supposed casino domain name.
I don't think this is a legitimate industry protection site. It's operated by a porno site promoter in Israel that also sells card counting software. Compare the whois info for www.beejack.com. Duh. There's no question in my mind that this needs to be shut down.
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| Posted by: babe at May 12, 2001, 7:54 am | | Topic: Casinos Using Player Blacklist Forum: Winner Online |
The problem with a list like this is that it looks like any of the member casinos can just put anybody on the list, justified or not. You could be a good player at many casinos. Then you happen to get a bonus at another and just play the minimum for one reason or another. Maybe you don't like the software, maybe you had a nice win and want to get out, whatever. This casino thinks your a bonus abuser and then your history.
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| Posted by: CasinoNow at May 11, 2001, 10:42 pm | | Topic: Casinos Using Player Blacklist Forum: Winner Online |
Dirk,
I would have to agree with you on the situation that you pointed out. It would be sort of like me losing everything I own on a single spin of the roulette wheel, and then saying nevermind, the bet is null and oid. I don't think you're likely to ever see a player get away with such behavior, and neither should the casino.
Once a casino accepts a bet then that's the end of it, win or lose. If they want to ban the player from coming back then fine, but it's not the players fault if the casino presented an edge, and the casino should live up to it's responsibilities. Especially if they knew in advance that the player had an increased risk of charging back or was known to abuse bonuses.
It seems to me that the casino, in the case you mentioned, accepted these wagers with full knowledge of this risk, and therefore chose to accept the fact that they may not come out ahead. If that's the way they want to be, then they should also return all losing players money who appeared on ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Jetset at May 11, 2001, 10:39 pm | | Topic: Casinos Using Player Blacklist Forum: Winner Online |
There have been many complaints regarding the action Dirk refers to above, which raises suspicions about the honesty of this site itself (which is owned by the same individual who runs the casino in question) and the accuracy of its listings.
In previous exchanges on this topic the point has been made that largely informal and unregulated blacklists are wide open to operator abuse in a number of ways and that is not acceptable.
It has been frequently pointed out that whilst players have no problem with operators protecting themselves in this at times pretty wild industry, it should be done in a way which respects the rights of the majority of players, who are straight-up.
Like for example notifying a player that he or she is being put on a blacklist and giving them an opportunity to appeal and examine the evidence being adduced against them. Such a notification would in itself chase the baddies away.
Maybe such a process is simply too much work for an operator or bla... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Dirk_Dangerous at May 11, 2001, 9:33 pm | | Topic: Casinos Using Player Blacklist Forum: Winner Online |
[q]so I really don't understand everyone's position on the subject.[/q]
I don't have a problem with the list either; casinos have a right to protect themselves from fraudsters and bonus hunters (and no, they aren't the same).
However, what I do find troubling is that one of the member casinos allowed players who are on the list to make deposits and play promotions.
When these players won, they then sent out Emails stating that all winnings were null & oid.
Sorry, but that's a big no no. As I understand it, Magic Oasis is the casino that did this. If this is the case, they would be well served to make things right.
If a casino wants to refuse a player's action, that is fine. As I said, I have no problems with this. But they can not take a person's bet and then refuse to pay when that person wins (assuming that all terms and conditions have been met and the player is legit).
The time to bar a player is before they play. Obviously, someone on the ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: CasinoNow at May 11, 2001, 2:55 pm | | Topic: Casinos Using Player Blacklist Forum: Winner Online |
I've seen mention of casinos sharing a player black list quite a bit over the last couple of months. It's almost odd that this concern is only now presenting itself, as casinos have been utilizing these lists for as long as they have been accepting credit cards, just the same as other companies processing cards without an in person isit have been using them for years before that.
The fact is that a negative card database and associated user information is an asset to any credit card processing company, and is really there for the protection of the operators. If you've ever disputed a charge and requested a charge back, your information goes into the negative database and every company using that card processor has access to the information.
Of course, how the information is utilized is ultimately up to the casino operator. Some sites ignore all listings unless they have processed a minimum number of charge backs, while others will refuse an account from any member who has ever charged ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: AmateurSleuth at May 11, 2001, 12:13 pm | | Topic: Casinos Using Player Blacklist Forum: Winner Online |
Has anyone been to this site?
http://www.onlinecasinomanagersasso...m/memsite.phtml
A group of online casinos have banded together to share player info, including cc #'s.
Here is the current list of member casinos:
Gold Key Casino
Casino World
Gambling Guide
Casino Domain
crown city casino
Monte Casino lard
Diamond Club Casino
2BetOn.com
iNetBet
williamhillcasino
DIAMOND COAST CASINO
Global Wager
Roman Palace Casino
The Casino Online
Lucky Winner Casino
MGM Casino Club
I-casino
the shore bet
Casino Gambling Network
Spades Casino & Sports Book
Casino On Air
Casino Bar
Java Casino
AchlaCasino
mgm casino club
MGM Casino Club
Casino Spy
Vegas Casino Online
CASINO NORDIC
Go2Jackpots
Royale Casino
Casino Gambler Network
Arcade Casino & Sportsbook
WorldwideVegas.com
Golden Bets Casino & Sportsbo... | | Read Entire Entry |
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