| Posted by: Dirk_Dangerous at January 17, 2002, 10:42 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Quote:
Refusing to address this not only hurts RTG directly, but it also hurts the licensees that are trying to run a reputable business.
Of course, this again just compounds the negative effect on RTG. (The licensees start to suffer as a result of RTG's "head in the sand" approach, the casinos lose players, RTG loses it's cut.)
...Some things I just don't understand. This is one of them.
Agree 100%, and this was all I was attempting to say in my original post.
I believe it is in RTG’s best interest to take sincere and far-reaching measures to restore player confidence in RTG sites. I certainly didn’t intend to “bash” RTG, the software provider. Simply put, if RTG would take a stand and be proactive on this issue, it would benefit RTG, it's licensees, and the players.
I just don't see how anyone can deny there is a serious problem with most RTG sites. Doing so serves no purpose. And accusing players of overreacting or making up fals... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: FairBet at January 17, 2002, 9:30 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Truly (in my eyes) the most damning part of all this is that they are not responding. Say something...anything.
Refusing to address this not only hurts RTG directly, but it also hurts the licensees that are trying to run a reputable business.
Of course, this again just compounds the negative effect on RTG. (The licensees start to suffer as a result of RTG's "head in the sand" approach, the casinos lose players, RTG loses it's cut.)
...Some things I just don't understand. This is one of them.
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Joe Plummer
www.fairbet.org
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| Posted by: gary at January 17, 2002, 5:10 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
sounds like all rtg casinos are taking the money and running.they have the money to pay their players they are just using excuses. like i always said and thought nothing but a bunch of sorry rip off crooks out there to get get rich quick and then split.
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| Posted by: PlayTheOdds at January 17, 2002, 2:14 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
It is quite reasonable for us players to mistrust ALL RTG casinos. The Casino Online demise PROVES that even a casino that has been paying promptly can suddenly shut down and take your money. I played at Casino Online regularly. I requested a withdrawal on January 4 and it was deposited to my PayPal account just two days later. Excellent - - I would have recommended Casino Online to anyone. Now, I deposited $500 on January 12 that I will probably never see. If Casino Online can go from a 2-day payer to a no-payer, any of the RTG casinos can do that. Don't play at any of them!!!!
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| Posted by: Gamerz at January 17, 2002, 1:54 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
zratpture, and now you name Grandbanks. I thought they and Blackwidow were the most reliable left. Now I don't know how to feel, as I just cashed out a fairly large sum from Blackwidow. I took it ia paypal, so if they pay, I won't be getting a check. What are the chances of them actually paying me my winnings?
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| Posted by: AmateurSleuth at January 17, 2002, 12:05 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Joel/VegasLobby,
You set yourself up as an arbiter of what are "childish" posts and what are not. I assume you mean that your posts are not "childish".
You entered this discussion of your own free will. Stand up and take it like a man. You're quick enough to dish it out, or do you just want to "take your ball and go home".
As to players discussing and making relevant information available to other players, if that is "childish" to you, then you are correct to leave. Players are owed thousands of dollars by these places, and you have the nerve to call them childish for complaining about it.
You say you have learned a lot running your portal, but you may not have learned nearly enough just yet. "Take the cotton out of your ears, and put it in your mouth" truly applies here.
The people here are experience gamblers, and I doubt you know more than this group does about online gambling, portal owner, or not.
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| Posted by: zrapture at January 17, 2002, 11:25 am | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Vegas Lobby,
Grand Banks has owed me money for 5 months now. I actually did receive a check but guess what, THE CHECK BOUNCED. They told it was being taken care of at least 10 times over the last 5 months, now they won't even respond to emails.
YEAH GREAT CASINO THERE!
Big deal you got paid, some players will. Look at The Casino Online. Somebody here got paid winnings in four days from them a few weeks ago when everyone else was being stalled, now their out of business.
Geand Banks wil go soon along with most of the other RTG's.
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| Posted by: gary at January 17, 2002, 10:01 am | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
i noticed most of rtg casinos were mentioned except for palaceofchance i still play there every now and then even thou their odds suck i also noticed that they don't have the safebet seal and the new slot machines are not progressive.does anyone still play there or had a cashin.
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| Posted by: DONGAMBLER at January 17, 2002, 9:51 am | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Oh ya.. one of the biggest differences between the group of thieves at RTG and say the group over at GSS is the RTG group is US based. Some of these people that are owed money should start a class action lawsuit against them. I think there would be a lot of merit in a suit like that. Remember, RTG controls the whole situation, software, support, etc. A suit against them could easily be won in my opinion.
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| Posted by: DONGAMBLER at January 17, 2002, 9:47 am | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
RTG is run by crooks. You can't call them anything else when they allow casios like Sci Fi, Merlin, Thecasinoonline, Worldplay to continue to accept deposits and bets with the knowledge that they are unable to pay any winners. Call it Party to the Crime, accomplice, or what you will the bottom line is they are just as crooked as the people running these casinos.
RTG and Safebet don't give a damn about paying the customers. As long as they are getting their licensee and certification fees they could care less about anything else. They didn't pull the plug on Merlin, World Play, THEcasinoonline UNTIL they couldn't pay these fees. Not when they couldn't pay customers months ago.
Lets hope they pull the plug on the crooks at Sci Fi before they get in any deeper.
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| Posted by: VegasLobby at January 17, 2002, 5:04 am | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
VEgasLobby is a portal - But I understand your frustration - but not every RTG casino has a payout issue, I reveiced a few thousand dollar check from Gand Banks in a matter of days.
Also - J - I checked the whoIs and it is not the same.
Maybe you have a muffle with this "group"
Anyways, go play and have fun - I am getting tired of all these childish posts.
I am not the one that keeps editing my posts!!
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come Visit!!!
http://www.vegaslobby.com
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| Posted by: Rabobi at January 17, 2002, 4:56 am | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Hi Joel
Firstly, thanks for coming onto the board to put your point of iew across. It isn't always a friendly place, as you have discovered.
I think the reason most people are miffed about RTG is the lack of transparency and honesty. A number of RTG casinos have folded in recent months, and the response from RTG has been less than adequate. Some players have lost thousands of dollars in deposits and legitimate winnings, and they have every right to be extremely angry. There is also a growing perception that all RTG casinos are in some kind of financial trouble. This stems from longer payout times from casinos that previously paid promptly, summary locking out of players who have won, and mysterious downtimes (when casino websites shut down for a few hours with no explanation).
RTG has played no small part in fuelling these perceptions, not least by its refusal to acknowledge that Safebet is owned and run by RTG. A lot of naive players see a Safebet logo and assume that the cas... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: VegasLobby at January 17, 2002, 4:22 am | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
I am a guy - and also, I started the other thread by mistake, so I am sorry for the torture I am putting you through - just wanted to make sure I get the point across in both threads!!
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come Visit!!!
http://www.vegaslobby.com
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| Posted by: VegasLobby at January 17, 2002, 4:16 am | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Wow,
You guys are a little feisty here!! Let me just state a few things – then I will get back to work:
Your Domain Registry is wrong –I checked it myself, and saw it completely different than the others.but you cut – copy and paste is working great!
I was accused of owning casino on net too!!! I wish…
Many casinos, take a system that is previously implemented such as Customer Support or a payout process, and they use those people (or that support team), so just because you will hear the same “Frank Jones” at one casino, doesn’t mean that the other casino that he answers for is a “sister” casino, he is just a good customer service rep.
Another thing is, the software providers do due diligence on the operators, so again, don’t get mad at the software providers, it is their responsibility to make sure the casinos are running nicely, not the payout system or the financial situation of any operator.
I happen to know that the Vegas Casino Online group does pay... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Jydeman at January 17, 2002, 1:46 am | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Vegaslobby:
The people behind Gamblers Lobby (+ 4 other new RTG's) are the people behind Twin Aces, Las Vegas USA (promoted on your site) and Vegas Casino Online. From what I can read, payouts aren't exactly their priority.
Registrant:
Gamblers Network
Plaza Bal Harbour
Paitilla
Panama, PA 10000
PA
Domain Name: TWINACESCASINO.COM
Administrative Contact:
Vargas, Fernando f.vargas@shannonmarketing.com
Plaza Bal Harbour
Paitilla
Panama, PA 10000
PA
000-000-0000
_____________________________________________
Registrant:
Gamblers Network
Plaza Bal Harbour
Paitilla
Panama, PA 10000
PA
Domain Name: GAMBLERSLOBBY.COM
Administrative Contact:
Vargas, Fernando f.vargas@shannonmarketing.com
Plaza Bal Harbour
Paitilla
Panama, PA 10000
PA
000-000-0000
[This message has been edited by Jydeman (edited 01-17-2002).]
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| Posted by: VegasLobby at January 17, 2002, 1:33 am | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
I must say, that after reading this post, I was saddened by the fact that a few measly operators are ruining the entire RTG reputation. I happen to know a few that helped ruin it, and they are running away now, however, I am sure that RTG or their new owners will make the payouts.
However, this has nothing to do with RTG, this is the operators choice (when to pay the players), I haven’t been paid by a Microgaming and a poker.com casino for well over a month now.
I must say - do your due diligence before playing at any casino to find out how and if they payout - forget all the certification BS (SafeBet – Gambling Commission – OPA) those are just fee oriented sites – and are all a crock of !@#$.
Call customer support, ask them their payout policy, and ream them a new ass if they don’t comply.
But in defense to RTG, I love their software, and have found many of their casinos do in fact pay on time.
Funny enough one new one (Gamblerslobby) says their priority is Pay... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Jetset at January 16, 2002, 10:13 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
These are the sort of thoughtful and informed comments which make WOL such a good message board.
At the end of the day I believe that RTG have not truly accepted a basic truth - that if you are cavalier in your attitude toward your ultimate consumers (in this case the players) then it will come back and bite you hard.
It has taken some time but that is what is now happening as a consequence of poor licencee etting, bad casino practice by the "weak link" licencees and the whole no-or-slow payout situation at far too many of the RTG casinos for comfort.
Experienced players are now asking themselves "can I really trust any RTG casinos in light of the comments being made all over the internet?" That is a ery dangerous doubt for any software provider and RTG's arrogance in adopting a "hands off" strategy and failing to communicate with its ultimate market or discipline its licencees is exacerbating the situation.
The alarm bells must be ringin... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: AmateurSleuth at January 16, 2002, 8:34 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Typical response from a "whiner" who refuses to accept responsibility for hiw own actions.
RTG upgraded its software. Fine, but the increase in fees was enough to send licensees over the edge from profitability to failure. Those operting on a shoe-string, with little to no cash reserves, would have no defense. Buy the software, or stop operating.
It was about this time that the first rumblings of "slow pay" were heard, I believe. Those crazy bonus rules became more outrageous. The players they had managed to acquire were being put off by the change in attitude. Players who won a little, and likely would have returned to play again and again, were being refused withdrawals, being locked out.
They were "biting the hand that feeds them", because they did not have enough of a reserve on hand to weather the small storm.
It all goes back to the attitude at the top really. If you sell to clients, and imply that they can cut corners, skim the edg... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: The Original Mary at January 16, 2002, 7:57 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Pretty good smear campaign if its shutting down casinos. Heck, this one isn't even orchestrated by the OPA. In fact, I don't know what evil genius is behind it.
Maybe the orbital mind control lasers.
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| Posted by: two_card at January 16, 2002, 7:16 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
I really like the software - graphics are good and the games play fast. Very ery few dropped connections when I play.
Unfortunately I will no longer play at these casinso. The two most recent failures still had significant money thst was owed to me. Three others in this group are behind by about three months and I am losing hope fast.
The most important facet about a casino is the ability to pay and pay promptly. Until RTG casinos demonstrates they can do this - I will not play and will tell others not tp play.
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| Posted by: Dirk_Dangerous at January 16, 2002, 7:11 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
The “smear campaign” comment is kind of odd IMO. I don’t know if there is any truth to the comments attributed to Michael Staw, but no one can deny that the majority of RTG sites are currently having serious problems. For players to discuss those problems is only natural, and it certainly isn’t an attempt to smear anyone. It’s an attempt to spare other players the agony of waiting long periods of time for or even losing their deposits and winnings.
I would also like to note, it wasn’t all that long ago that many of us gave ery strong endorsements to a number of RTG sites. At that time, a number of RTG sites were some of the best on the web; payments were fast, customer service was good, and promotions were fair. Really, RTG received quite a bit of free press. RTG should have capitalized on all that great word-of-mouth advertising.
But it seems to me that RTG only looked at the short run; and only cared about selling casinos to anyone with a checkbook and a dream. Unfortunately, that k... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Trader at January 16, 2002, 7:01 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
The only smear going on is by all the RTG licensees who regularly fail to pay players as promised. How many RTG casinos make even 50% of their payouts within the terms on the web site? I really don't know the legal connection between RTG and the cash processor that all its licensees use. I find it hard to believe there is no connection if they are free to use other processors and all choose the same one. Until they can prove differently, I believe they know ery well the sites are not paying. RTG also knows about the privacy policy iolations and the many weak excuses of bonus abuse aired here so regularly. How can an honest software provider find so many financially and ethically unstable people to operate online casinos?
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| Posted by: jondo at January 16, 2002, 5:36 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
01.17.02 - Real Time Gaming's Michael Staw insists there is smear campaign against him but also tells Sting they are doing whatever possible to make sure their licensees pay players after credit card processing woes.
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| Posted by: tonyd at January 16, 2002, 4:24 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
I agree 100%.
I have played at numerous RTG casinos in the past. As these places started having problems, I became more selective about which RTG casinos I would play. As of a few weeks ago, the only ones I would still play were Grand Banks and Black Widow. I have now decided that I will NOT play any RTG casino until things change for the better.
I love the software and speed but I hate the slow pay/no pay. At this point playing RTG casinos is not worth the risk. There are still many reputable casinos on the web and these are the ones who will get my business.
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| Posted by: tonyd at January 16, 2002, 4:23 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
I agree 100%.
I have played at numerous RTG casinos in the past. As these places started having problems, I became more selective about which RTG casinos I would play. As of a few weeks ago, the only ones I would still play were Grand Banks and Black Widow. I have now decided that I will NOT play any RTG casino until things change for the better.
I love the software and speed but I hate the slow pay/no pay. At this point playing RTG casinos is not work the risk. There are still many reputable casinos on the web and these are the ones who will get my business.
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| Posted by: Dirk_Dangerous at January 16, 2002, 4:00 pm | | Topic: Comments for Real Time Gaming Executives Forum: Winner Online |
Let’s face it; things are looking ery grim for many of your licensees. Merlin has gone under. World Play is reported to be out of business and there are numerous reports of other sites having problems. In addition, almost all RTG licensees are paying ery, ery slowly (if at all).
IMO, RTG is at a crucial point. Either you do something bold and drastic to restore player confidence in RTG casino sites or you risk the ery real possibility of all RTG sites falling like so many dominos. Hiding your head in the sand isn’t going to solve anything.
The fact is, most serious players will tell any new online gambler to avoid any RTG site like the plague. The problems are just too similar across all your sites. Is this really what you intended for your franchise? I don’t think so.
I urge you to be proactive on this. It seems to me you have a number of options available, one of which would be to guarantee player deposits and winnings.
I also urge the owners of still solvent RTG ... | | Read Entire Entry |
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