| Posted by: medali at February 28, 2002, 12:58 pm | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Gaijinsan:
Paypal is providing you with a service - transferring money from you to whoever you want to pay. If they didn't charge for their service how could they afford to stay in business?
Why is it more expensive for Paypal to transfer money for people living outside the U.S.? I haven't got a clue. All I know is, no matter who you're dealing with, if you want to purchase goods and services from outside of your own country you have to expect to pay a premium for it. That rule applies whether you're dealing with Paypal, a credit card, or a bank. Sorry, that's just the way it works. (Unless you live in the U.S., in which case more people are willing to cater to you.) If you don't like it, go to your local bar and play the VLT's instead of playing online.
If what Paypal is doing could be considered fraud, then Visa would also be guilty. When a credit card company converts currency for you, they also charge you a transaction fee on top of the conversion rate. You just don't ge... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: gaijinsan at February 28, 2002, 2:20 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Oh, yes...
It didn't really hit me until now, (even as I wrote the original post), and when I went to check my statement today, it confirmed my suspicions.
The money taken off my credit card was in US FUNDS! So, PayPal is getting paid by Visa in US$, and then they hit me AGAIN for an int'l currency conversion!
What the hell is this??? Is this not outright fraud? Someone please explain this to me. I MUST be missing something simple...
Thanks!
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| Posted by: gambler45 at February 27, 2002, 4:00 pm | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Hi,
I just purchased $40US from my Pay Pal Account at Prestige Casino. Cashed out at $61.50, and decided to have the winnings sent back to my paypal account. Why you ask? Because WebDollar takes a god damm long time to send cheques. Anyone know how long it should take to get my paypal winings?
Thanks,
Jamie
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| Posted by: tkf18ny at February 27, 2002, 9:02 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
you are correct in saying that many innocent people have money invested in paypal and i do not hope here people lose money
however if paypal keep up in aiding criminals commit fraud (see paypalsucks.com)
paypal should not automatically eat the cost however they should bear some responsibilty in that they are being paid for a service and told me it was ok to ship my items
in addition to this they refuse to help me in any way
i would love to contact the credit card comapny and have them eat the bill but paypal will neither tell me who the credit card company is or contact them on my behalf
in addition to this how do i know if paypal is not lying and just stealing my money since they give me no other info"?
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| Posted by: gaijinsan at February 27, 2002, 8:03 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
tkf18ny,
Please forgive me. I understand your plight of being ripped off for $600, but I fail to see what PayPal can/should do? Stolen credit cards... Shouldn't the credit card company be footing the bill for this? Contact the CC Co. and file a complaint with them. PayPal is just a money transfer service. If Visa or whoever debits their account because of disputed charges on proven stolen cards, then what are they supposed to do about that? Eat the loss?
Honestly, I understand your anger, but isn't it misdirected? Maybe I just don't know enough about how it all works.
Although... I will agree with you about their CS. I can't find an email address or phone number on their site to just ask a simple question! They do have this stupid form you can fill out, but the answer is auto-reponse and they didn't come close to sending me the correct answer!
Still, I hope you're wrong about their stock. Lots of people have money in PP (including me), and your wish would affect many ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: tkf18ny at February 27, 2002, 7:41 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
people did use stolen credit cards to buy items from me
this is obviously not paypals fault
however its is there fault that they told me that the charges were reversed months after the fact
so even though i waited until i took the money from my paypal acct and put in in my bank account before i shipped the items and months later the charges were reveresed paypal took away 600 dollars from my account
leaving my balance at -600
before i realized this i made a sportsbook withdrawl into paypal for 275 dollars (approx) and the next day i discovered that my balance was NEGATIVE 325
paypalsucks.com has many stories juist like mine
some even worse
the worse thing about this is that paypal enables thius fraud and then refuses to help me by giving the info they have about who commited the fraud or getting the credit card companies to pay
i hope their stock ends up like enrons
the treat customers like **** and although the may legally be right on principle i would never... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Got2Bet at February 27, 2002, 6:42 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Medali -
Yes, I have a premier account. But I use it to pay for most things, I only receive ery small payments once a month in that account, if at all.
Really stupid if you ask me LOL. Fortunately, I know people there who just have to raise their eyebrows at the right time with the support team and immediately the restriction is removed.
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Spearmaster
Got2Bet - Online Gambling News and Information
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| Posted by: gaijinsan at February 27, 2002, 4:41 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Yeah, you know, if I had just seen the PayPal Sucks! site, then I might not have worried about it much. It was the MSNBC article than alarmed me, and the fact that there is a class action lawsuit, not a single one, is grounds to perhaps believe there may be something amiss.
Without being regulated, it's easy as hell to get ripped.
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| Posted by: joeyl at February 27, 2002, 4:35 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Dear gaijinsan.Hello there..
I assumed and/or guessed what you did regarding Pal fraud etc..
I have seen a site called Paypal sucks which if to be believed,tells us Pal are useless when it comes to such matters..Locking perfectly honest customers(hmmm)away from thier funds because somewhere along the line, someone else may have tried to defraud YOU!
Someone here will know the url and if its allowed to be put up here or not..
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| Posted by: gaijinsan at February 27, 2002, 4:18 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
tkf18ny,
What do you mean they stole $600 from you?
Seems to me that those who stole from you were the ones using the stolen credits cards to buy your goods, no?
Of course, I'm making some assumptions here though. Namely, that the people who bought items from you used stolen credit cards, the transactions went through, the owners of the cards noticed the charges, disputed them as unauthorized, the credit card company reverses the charges, PayPal doesn't get their money from the card company, and you, in turn, do not get yours.
If this is what happened, then PayPal is in no way at fault. You got ripped off, yes, but not by PP.
However, if this is not what happened, would you please share more of the story? If it was PayPal's fault, I'd like to know!
Thanks!
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| Posted by: medali at February 26, 2002, 2:33 pm | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Got2Bet:
Do you have a merchant account (or premium, or whatever they call it)? I thought the locking out only happened with upgraded accounts that were regularly accepting payments.
If you have an international (regular, not merchant) account and you have enough money already sitting in your Paypal account to pay a bill, you don't get charged anything by Paypal for making the payment. Some merchants may have a fee for paying you but that's coming off on their end. I've never played at a casino that charged me to deposit or withdraw by Paypal, but that doesn't mean there aren't any.
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| Posted by: medali at February 26, 2002, 2:30 pm | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Gaijinsan:
The Cdn$ has weakened some over the last week, so that will be part of your problem. Even if the exchange rates stayed constant, buying and selling money works the same way as any other commodity - the money dealer (the bank, Paypal, credit card company) has to buy it at a lower cost than he's selling it for if he wants to make a profit. And we know the money dealers definitely want to make a profit, right?
If you know you're going to be using Paypal to pay for stuff again in the near future, leave the balance in your Paypal account instead of racking up transaction fees for transferring in and out.
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| Posted by: medali at February 26, 2002, 2:28 pm | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Caruso:
If I understood your question correctly, you want to know how to put money into a Paypal account and let it sit there so you can use it later, yes? If I'm wrong, just skip the rest of this.
How you can fund your Paypal account depends on where you live, and it can only be done by bank account or cheque - you can't use your credit card just to put funds in your Paypal account and let them sit there. From Paypal's help screens:
Which International members may add bank accounts?
PayPal will always accept U.S. bank accounts from our International members. If you live in Australia, Canada, France, Germany, Hong Kong, Japan, Mexico, the Netherlands, New Zealand, Singapore, Spain, or the United Kingdom , you may also register your local bank account with PayPal. We are continually working to add the functionality to accept bank accounts from other countries. Be sure to check back often to see if your country has been added.
I've never funded from my bank a... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: vickinz at February 26, 2002, 12:42 pm | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Caruso writes: If any international (non US) user can tell me 1) that it is possible to fund a Paypal account (ie. deposit maony and leave it there, for the purposes of recycling it around casinos and avoiding the exchange rate whammy) and 2) how the hell you do it, I'd be in your debt. To date I've had to make do with Firepay and NETeller"
No one would answer my many queries online re this subject, so I hope I've understood your question correctly.
I am non-US resident; funded Paypal using credit card then deposited into most casinos using that. When winning, deposit would be credited back there, but now usually profit as well...GP and affiliates, Prestige and some other Boss Media/Gamblers Lobby/Good as Gold, etc etc take 1 - l4 days now to credit winnings into Paypal instead of the weeks it used to take by mail. So I am constantly using the same money to redeposit elsewhere.
If funding Paypal by credit card, after you have filled in registration, they debit a coupla $... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: DizzyD at February 26, 2002, 11:06 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
I am from USA. To get quick withdrawals of excess funds from paypal, I would go to Twin Aces casino and make a $2500 deposit getting a 25% bonus. I would meet wager reqs. then make withdrawal. I would receive check for total amt. within two weeks of cashout ia Fedex. No charge. Unfortunately, RTGs are no longer noted for their quick payouts. Also, I rarely find casinos that offer bonuses on large deposits that return dep.+ winnings to player that use other software. A list of a few would be appreciated.
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| Posted by: gaijinsan at February 26, 2002, 8:10 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Dan, that's a good idea. Thanks!
Ok, I think I understand... (maybe)
Does this make sense, then?
- Get a Firepay account and a PayPal account.
- Fund the Firepay acct. with Visa. (only get hit with the Visa exchange rate - no 2.6%+ fees)
- Pay casino with Firepay (free)
- Withdraw from casino to PayPal acct. (free)
- do this for every casino that will pay to PayPal
- when i've got a large balance that I want to cash out, buy chips at a reputable casino that will wire my money to me for free
- play a bit to show good customer relationship
- when satisfied, have them wire the money to my bank account in Canada
Of course, it might still be better to buy with PayPal anyway, because most casinos seem to be offering 5%+ bonus for PayPal payments. That takes care of the 2.6% PP charges you...
got2bet: yeah, the transaction from PP to the casino is free, but from my card to PP, I gotta pay the charge.
caruso: If it's possible, I c... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: dan at February 26, 2002, 6:15 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Paypal is best suitable for US citizen, but not non-US citizen. It's real expensive for international account.
But there is a trick you can use to minimize the transaction cost incurred by Paypal. Deposit the money in your Paypal account into a casino(of course they must accept Paypal deposit). Then withdraw all at once(or you can play for a while there) by wire transfer. This should cost you fewer. The more you do it this way, the more you save. This works for me.
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| Posted by: Got2Bet at February 26, 2002, 5:47 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Actually, I find PayPal extremely convenient. Now if they would only stop randomly locking my account for no reason... LOL...
BTW, just so you PayPal users know - the locking has ZILCH to do with online gaming. I suspect it has more to do with when you use PayPal to pull funds from your credit card instead.
I got locked out for - get this - paying for advertising and content. And I hadn't used my PayPal card for online gaming purposes in about three months.
Still, it's extremely convenient. BTW, aren't transactions to certain casinos supposed to not cost you anything? Don't have an international account so I wouldn't know...
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Spearmaster
Got2Bet - Online Gambling News and Information
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| Posted by: caruso at February 26, 2002, 5:47 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
That exchange rate is better than any I've been subjected to; I usually figure between 4 and 5%.
International users may be able to "fund" a Paypal account, but I have always been told, by them, that it can't be done; this option is only available to US citizens.
If any international (non US) user can tell me 1) that it is possible to fund a Paypal account (ie. deposit maony and leave it there, for the purposes of recycling it around casinos and avoiding the exchange rate whammy) and 2) how the hell you do it, I'd be in your debt. To date I've had to make do with Firepay and NETeller.
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| Posted by: vickinz at February 26, 2002, 5:45 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
It's cheaper than the heaps I lost on currency fluctuations when only check options available. Sometimes on $500 - $1000US deposits I would lose 10-l5% by the time the deposit was credited back to my card as our $ dived last year.
Firepay don't charge extra; often casinos will credit deposit amount to Firepay and pay winnings into Paypal...built up a good nestegg only to lose big because of greed in taking up big bonus offers LOL!
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| Posted by: gaijinsan at February 26, 2002, 5:27 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
That's a good point. I didn't think about that.
What about the controversy surrounding the lock-outs and such? How nervous should I be about losing my balance? I've read a few complaints about people losing thousands of dollars, or at least not gaining access to their money.
How many people here have experienced trouble with them?
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| Posted by: Tester at February 26, 2002, 5:21 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
1) exchange is an expensive business everywhere. And the exact rates are fluctuating from day to day and from exchanger to exchanger. Sometimes, you get in 1 place rates of yesterday, someplace, of today morning, and somewhere else of this minute.
2) Paypal the best deal when you are leaving the money there and transfer in and out in dollars to the casinos. This way, you lose only once, when depositing into Paypal and when withdrawing from Paypal to you pocket. You may turn over the funds 1000 times in and out to casinos without losing a cent.
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| Posted by: gaijinsan at February 26, 2002, 5:19 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Yeah, I know. Sucks, don't it?
It's just that, with those kinds of charges, it effectively reduces your edge by an awful lot. My expected rate of return sits at like 90% with BJ. Pretty low!
But then again, I guess driving to AC or flying to LV ain't exactly cheap either, eh?
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| Posted by: Got2Bet at February 26, 2002, 5:12 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
Kinda expensive in a way, but actually the exchange rate fluctuation still looks better than most banks I see.
If you get a chance, go to a bank with a forex board which displays the buy and sell rates - and look at the difference between buying and selling rates. I would enture that 7 cents CDN is well within the norm.
Still, your point is taken - it can be a bit expensive to use PayPal for transactions unless you are a net winner.
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Spearmaster
Got2Bet - Online Gambling News and Information
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| Posted by: gaijinsan at February 26, 2002, 5:01 am | | Topic: PayPal... OH... MY... GOD...!!! Internatinonal accounts. Forum: Winner Online |
I am in shock.
I opened an account with PayPal last week to take advantage of the 10% bonuses that some casinos are offering, and also so that I could get my winnings (if I actually manage to get some! ha ha) faster than waiting for a check.
Then I realize, as I'm signing up, that it'll cost me more than 2.6% + $0.30 in fees for each deposit to PayPal because it's an int'l account. Expensive, but the PayPal bonus takes care of well more than that.
I buy credits for $1.62 CDN per with my credit card through PayPal. Play a little, lose my bonus by the time I play through, and then cash out. Start waiting for my money to PayPal.
Then I start hearing about the lawsuit and how tons of people have been locked out of their accounts for no reason, and how PayPal has the crappiest CS ever. Horror stories abound and I'm thinking, "great, even if the casino doesn't screw me, PayPal will." Getting scared now.
Finally, (actually only four business days later), I... | | Read Entire Entry |
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