| Posted by: bart at August 12, 2003, 5:48 pm | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by ohdreampop:
It may be best to read from the bottom of this on up... as the email correspondance started there.
This is insane.
ODP,
It says that the rule isn't on their site. I did locate it in their help file for Red Dog. Did they add it after you raised the issue?
Not that it matters. Still isn't right but I would like to know.
bart
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| Posted by: KX at August 12, 2003, 6:08 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote:
That is indeed a good find!
Lol, yes ery. While playing "hundreds of hands" he found that you lose too often with a queen upcard.
Let's say he played 500 hands. Of these 500 3/51 should have been occasions with two of the same card. That is approx 16. 484 hands remaining. Of these 24/169 should be "spread 0". That is approx 69. 415 hands remain. Of these approx 85% does not include a queen. Thus approx 62 hands remain. I don't know exactly how many hands you win on average in Red Dog, but I would say approx 30%. Thus he should have won about 19 hands with a queen showing. He won some of these hands, but not as many as he expected.
It would have been quite surprising if none of the upcard results deviated significantly from expectation. In this case it's not even certain that it was a large deviation from the 19 expected.
Nice find? I don't think so.
[This message has been edited by KX (edited 08-12-2003).]
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| Posted by: bart at August 11, 2003, 8:53 pm | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by ohdreampop:
Well, I'D say that if you think that receiving a 15.80% HA s. a normal 3.16% HA is not cause to feel cheated, then you should not make gambling with real money your hobby.
No doubt about it. You where cheated. Does anyone have any leaverage with this group?
One would have to assume the trap was intential until some explanation is made and reparation paid. And one would have to assume that the rest of the games are not straight.
Accordingly, the group would have to be listed as rogue, IMHO.
bart
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| Posted by: bonuslover at August 11, 2003, 4:33 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by Miamivce:
I've noticed that - if one of the two cards of the deal is a QUEEN, no matter what the other is - you LOSE!
That is indeed a good find! However, I can't erify it myself because RTG has burned me either by not paying or messing with the odds (like Inter has burned you) and I swear I would never return.
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| Posted by: Miamivce at August 11, 2003, 2:25 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Red Dog players:
This is an observation I've made after hundreds of hands in RTG casinos. Would love for someone to comment on this after they check this out:
I've noticed that - if one of the two cards of the deal is a QUEEN, no matter what the other is - you LOSE! If you play RD at RTGs, check this out. Of course, it won't happen all the time, but just track the probability of you winning the hand (based on what the other card is) and what your result is whenever a QUEEN is one of the cards.
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| Posted by: ohdreampop at August 8, 2003, 6:33 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by gamblinboi:
imo, this is a scum tactic on behalf the casino. Can you really call game ABC game ABC if it has a HA 5x worse than game ABC? This completely changes the nature of the game, and imo deserves a new name. (in this case, maybe Beaten Bloody Red Dog..)
Well put... finally from someone who knows what he's talking about.
Oh, and Jydeman: If you knew about this, why didn't you post to let others know? I did a search for Aqua before I played there and I wish I would have seen that. :/
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| Posted by: ohdreampop at August 8, 2003, 6:31 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by Chillie Boya:
Its exactly like Aqua's so I dont think that they out to get anyone nor is it a glitch.
Well, those incredible "sources" you pulled from google are called portals. Sure the two portals you decided to post could look exactly like Aqua... and they could have gotten their info from there, as well. Lord, I'd love to read the bibliography of one of your research papers...
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| Posted by: gamblinboi at August 8, 2003, 5:34 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
imo, this is a scum tactic on behalf the casino. Can you really call game ABC game ABC if it has a HA 5x worse than game ABC? This completely changes the nature of the game, and imo deserves a new name. (in this case, maybe Beaten Bloody Red Dog..)
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| Posted by: Chillie Boya at August 8, 2003, 3:39 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
ODP and the rest of u, I've been looking on google and picked up some casino's that offer Red dog poker AND RULES..some of them have rules similar to Aqua casino's and some not.
Why not have a look at : http://www.toppoker.org/red-dog.html
And http://www.gamingday.com/reddog.shtml
Its exactly like Aqua's so I dont think that they out to get anyone nor is it a glitch.
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| Posted by: Mrracetrack at August 8, 2003, 2:36 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Posted by allCasinosCheat...
"but to achieve those 15% you need to wager a lot more and receive a quite big amount of high paying hands.
I am just curious, didnt you see it when you received high paying hands? IF you only received even money hands, then it doenst matter if HA WAS 15 or 3 percent in your case..."
It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt.
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| Posted by: allCasinosCheat at August 8, 2003, 2:04 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by ohdreampop:
Well, I'D say that if you think that receiving a 15.80% HA s. a normal 3.16% HA is not cause to feel cheated, then you should not make gambling with real money your hobby.
no offence wasment in my posts dreampop.
but to achieve those 15% you need to wager a lot more and receive a quite big amount of high paying hands.
I am just curious, didnt you see it when you received high paying hands? IF you only received even money hands, then it doenst matter if HA WAS 15 or 3 percent in your case.
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| Posted by: ohdreampop at August 7, 2003, 9:40 pm | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by allCasinosCheat:
So i'd say you werent cheated that big at all.
Well, I'D say that if you think that receiving a 15.80% HA s. a normal 3.16% HA is not cause to feel cheated, then you should not make gambling with real money your hobby.
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| Posted by: allCasinosCheat at August 7, 2003, 9:13 pm | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by ohdreampop:
This isn't even worth a response, but obviously you don't know the game. Play it before you speak. Try WINNING a high paying hand after 4-5 hands. Sure it's possible, but ery unlikely. I'm respecting Max's rule of no insults while biting my lip.
What i ment is when you got such i high-hand, didnt you see anything funky?
and yes, i played red dog and get high paying hands after 4-5 hands, i dunno what your problem is.
As you told, you were cheated only on high hands, not even hands. and as you stated you only got few cheated hands right, and even hands all the time? So i'd say you werent cheated that big at all. Perhaps you lost due to this cheat 20 bucks, but you could also see it as bad luck!
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| Posted by: hhcfreebie at August 7, 2003, 3:08 pm | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
If BJ is forbidden I play VP, If even VP is banned I play war instead of red dog.
Why war?
It's super stable (lower STD than BJ) and the element of risk is a little over 2%. Comparing to red dog, with a house edge of 3.16% (1 deck) the element of risk "might" be comparable to War but the ariance is pretty big. I don't like to see 1-2 spread keeps comming up on my table. If I want higher ariance I'd rather bet bigger.
Another bonus is War is fast and brainless, perfect for a middle aged, lazy man like myself, just raise on tie!
It may be laughable but I mis-calculated the spread on red dog quite a few times.
ACC I hope you know why we can't know they are cheating or not in a few hands, for 3 spread the chance of win is only 24%. It's also easy to miss how much they pay me when I play really fast (RTG).
Anyway red dog is indeed a fun game, my nick name while I was in collage is, in fact, red dog. It's also ery cute to see the sleepy dog sitting on different pay table. | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Jydeman at August 7, 2003, 1:42 pm | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Heh - dreampop. I used to play a lot of Red Dog on MG. I once gave it a try on Golden Palace. After playing a while I ended up on phone telling them something was wrong with the payout on their Red Dog game. I was transferred to a pitboss who explained the rules. I told him they were crazy - and he said they considered changing them. This was in the summer of 2001
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| Posted by: ohdreampop at August 7, 2003, 12:21 pm | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by allCasinosCheat:
but didnt you noticed it after 4-5 hands?
This isn't even worth a response, but obviously you don't know the game. Play it before you speak. Try WINNING a high paying hand after 4-5 hands. Sure it's possible, but ery unlikely. I'm respecting Max's rule of no insults while biting my lip.
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| Posted by: ohdreampop at August 7, 2003, 8:47 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by hhcfreebie:
Why did you play Red Dog on the first place ODP?
I was well ahead on BJ and thought I'd try out their other games for a bit. I like to do that sometimes, especially when I'm trying out software I haven't played before.
As far as them not knowing the game, I think I should get back all money I wagered on that game. I would not have played had I known about that ridiculous rule.
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| Posted by: hhcfreebie at August 7, 2003, 8:44 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
Terrible terrible....
It's even worse than pay even money on your Blackjack!
I think they didn't program it that way on purpose, they just don't understand the rules.
Why did you play Red Dog on the first place ODP?
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online gambling "watcher".
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| Posted by: ohdreampop at August 7, 2003, 7:41 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
The Wiz agreed with me and updated his site to say this after testing it out at King Soloman's:
"If you play Red Dog I urge you not to play at an Aqua Online casino. Unlike the conventional rules which pay increased odds for spreads of 3 or less, at Aqua casinos the original bet always only pays even money. Only the raise pays more than 1 to 1 on spreads of 3 or less, which you shouldn't raise on anyway. A single deck of cards is used. The result of Aqua Online paying even money on the original bet increases the house edge from the normal 3.16% to 15.80% (ouch!)."
Even though I feel ery cheated, I'm glad that he did this so that less people will be burned by it in the future.
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| Posted by: ohdreampop at August 7, 2003, 6:37 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
For those who don't know the game, you are only supposed to raise if it's a 7 point spread or more. You call otherwise... and your original ante is indeed supposed to pay the amount shown regardless of whether or not you raise.
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| Posted by: ohdreampop at August 7, 2003, 6:34 am | | Topic: Geisha Lounge has messed up game of Red Dog Forum: Winner Online |
It may be best to read from the bottom of this on up... as the email correspondance started there.
This is insane.
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Sir or Madam,
I play the game Red Dog ALL the time both on all different software online AND on land, and that is NOT how the game is played. I have played Microgaming, Realtime Gaming, Playtech, etc. Check it out for yourself.
There is no mention of that crazy rule you mention anywhere on the Wizard of Odds site or on yours. That rule is simply absurd and I have never seen it anywhere else. That is not the game of Red Dog.
I'll contact the Wizard of Odds to re-review the house edge of your game of Red Dog if that was not a software glitch and indeed an absurd "rule" completely exclusive to Geisha Lounge (or Aqua software?). I lost nearly every hand I played (which is normal), and the higher paying hands are supposed to (somewhat) make up for that. Your game of Red Dog was reviewed as having a house edge of 3.16%, whi... | | Read Entire Entry |
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