| Posted by: The Original Mary at January 12, 2004, 2:06 pm | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
As to Palace of Chance, they have had some changes in ownership too, so it's important for players to specify when they had problems. Since the "new" Blast 21 and the "new" Palace of Chance are under the same ownership now, players might want to contact bet2gamble.com for mediation.
Again, be aware that any RTG casino changing hands can have cooked books. This can apply to affiliate debts as well as player debts.
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| Posted by: The Original Mary at January 12, 2004, 2:00 pm | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
Two years ago, it was the OPA handling this.
OPA was already warning players about RTG casinos in general and new RTG's in particular. By the time players were ready to present complaints, Mike Craig was taking them.
I didn't push the Blast situation because it looks like both losers and winners got their deposits back, "rewinding the ideo tape", which I consider a fair resolution.
It's tough two years later to know exactly what happened; if the outgoing owners wanted to, they could have entered fake payouts into the accounting; that's according to RTG. The new owners would not know about unpaid players and would iew players coming forward with claims with suspicion.
I suggest that players with outstanding payments owed first contact Blast 21 for copies of their records of two years ago. If Blast is unresponsive, notify the webmaster at bet2gamble.com who has offered to mediate complaints that have documentation.
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| Posted by: zrapture at March 8, 2002, 10:55 pm | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
For all exisiting players that get the following combinations between the 14th and 17th February 2002 the following bonus winnings apply. Please send an e-mail to us at pitboss@blast21.com with BLACKJACK LOVERS (for the Blackjack pros out there) or VIDEO POKER LOVERS (for the Poker pros) in the subject line - we will then credit your account with your BONUS winnings on the 21 of February 2002.
Terms and conditions
Blackjack Promotion
Ace and King of Hearts $500.00
Ace and Queen of Hearts $300.00
Ace and Jack of Hearts $150.00
Ace and Ten of Hearts $ 75.00
Video Poker Promotion
Royal flush in Hearts $500.00
Straight flush in Hearts $250.00
Any Flush in Hearts $125.00
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| Posted by: The Original Mary at March 6, 2002, 9:27 pm | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
I just want to double-check: this was a promotion that was suicidal for the casino. Some players knew this; I'm sure many didn't.
Did they refund the deposits of everyone who played during this period, i.e., rewind the ideotape for all players?
Or did they keep losers' monies and fail to honor the promotion to winners?
If they "rewound the ideotape" for everybody, and gave some extra "we screwed up apology money" to players, I would consider that fair.
If they kept the deposits of losers, and failed to honor the promotion in its entirety, I would consider that fraud.
A statement from RTG on how they are screening future promotions, or training new casino managers, or even SUGGESTING GOOD BOOKS FOR THEM TO READ would be welcome.
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| Posted by: zrapture at February 23, 2002, 1:55 pm | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
Quote: Originally Posted by Sirius:
I played this promotion but the terms didn't even say clearly if you could claim the bonuses more than once. I emailed them and they said you could for the first 210 hands. The Video Poker bonuses were only available once I think they said. This wasn't mentioned in the promotion terms.
Did you all assume you could get the bonus multiple times without emailing them to make sure?
If they said it was unlimited then you would have a point. But if you didn't email them to find out, for all you knew you might only have been able to get the bonuses once.
Sirius-
I did in fact email them after they changed their terms to the 210 hand maximum. They replied that since I started before the change that I could play the whole weekend without any limit. They said it explicitly. They also said in the email that it was thier mistake and they honor their mistakes.
I'm aware of other players who were even quoted their accumulated bonus to ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: The Original Mary at February 23, 2002, 11:48 am | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
Is it *realistic" to expect them to honor their bonus?
No.
Is it *reasonable* to expect them to honor their offer?
Yes.
A lot of players who took them up probably didn't know the odds any better than the casino did.
Is the casino going to refund deposits to players who lost on this promotion? Because to be fair they should.
Secondly, what does this say about RTG's new policy of closer oversight? Contingency funding? Review of unsustainable promotions?
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| Posted by: Sirius at February 23, 2002, 10:27 am | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
I played this promotion but the terms didn't even say clearly if you could claim the bonuses more than once. I emailed them and they said you could for the first 210 hands. The Video Poker bonuses were only available once I think they said. This wasn't mentioned in the promotion terms.
Did you all assume you could get the bonus multiple times without emailing them to make sure?
If they said it was unlimited then you would have a point. But if you didn't email them to find out, for all you knew you might only have been able to get the bonuses once.
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| Posted by: playerdave at February 23, 2002, 7:42 am | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
'Dear Casino- Oops, I'm sorry. I shouldn't have maxed out my credit cards for twice my entire life savings and put it all on black. Can't believe red came up. That was some pretty poor advice my accountant gave me. You'll be glad to hear that I will no longer be using his services. Unfortunately I won't be paying you. That would cause me to file for bankruptcy and we can't have that. Thank you and I look forward to playing with you again'
Until the above example of a letter is alid, blast 21 owes myself and others
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| Posted by: croupier at February 23, 2002, 6:20 am | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
Einstein: I never said I agreed or disagreed with the casinos behaviour either, I was just pointing out a fact.
You were saying it's not the owners fault for having useless staff, when the fact is that it's the owners fault for abything that goes wrong - the buck has to stop somewhere, and that place is at the top.
You said in your last post that the casino does not have the money to pay - how do you know this?
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| Posted by: slotski at February 23, 2002, 5:32 am | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
I thought RTG was going to make new casinos fund a special account which they would control to pay disputes such as this as a precondition to signing them up.
That the management came up with something that is such a money losing deal is mind boggling.
I hope that RTG comes here quickly to deal with this. Mr. Staw has been trying to clean up the act of all of the rogue RTG casinos and I applaud his efforts so far although he has much more to deal with.
But after all that has gone on in the past, for a new RTG site to be so idiotic as to offer this promo it tells me that all of the talk about scrutinizing new licensees in regards to financial strength, management skills etc. was just that, TALK.
Even though i understan Einsteins point and it is alid, RTG better clean this mess up fast or everything he has done so far is to get people back to their sites will go right down the tubes as this is exactly the type of thing that started the original problems.
Mr. S... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: caruso at February 23, 2002, 4:55 am | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
This three day promo as it stood was obviously unsustainable; I simply decided to give it a miss as something was clearly wrong somewhere; on seeing the 210 hand rule addition I thougtht about giving it a shot, but over that short space of time it was pretty much worthless. It's a pity someone was so incompetent and just damn stupid to offer such a ridiculous deal in the first place; I wonder if some of these places actually know anything about the games they offer.
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| Posted by: einstein at February 23, 2002, 4:39 am | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
I guess my English is not good enough.
I did not endorse the casino's behavior, and I did not say that the casino should not pay.
All I was saying is that, in reality, they will not pay the $100,000s owed on this stupid promotion, and everyone knows that.
Do you honestly think you will get the $10,000 bonus when you are playing a game with 30% edge£¿Yes, the casino should pay the bonuses when players followed their rules, but they do not have the money to pay. I think the players were all aware of that when they played, but it was still worth a shot. After all, on average one only loses 0.6% on BJ, and have a shot at 30% bonuses. I'm sure that most players still came out ahead though they did not get the full bonuses.
[This message has been edited by einstein (edited 02-23-2002).]
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| Posted by: croupier at February 23, 2002, 2:25 am | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
Quote:
It might only be the stupidity of one or two persons working for the casino, and you can not expect the owner to pay $100,000s for this mistake and go out of business.
The owner is ultimatly responsible for the decisions of his/her staff.
If they have a problem with this then they have 2 options:
1. Take more care when putting someone in a position of authority.
2. Resign and take up a job with less responsibility.
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| Posted by: AmateurSleuth at February 23, 2002, 12:02 am | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
Einstein,
I have to disagree with you! Idiot business owners go out of business everyday. Ever heard of "Enron"?
Yes, they should close their doors, and not take another penny of players' money. Do I expect them to do this? No, because in the cyberworld, they can duck and dodge their creditors and stay online, so long as they pay "the right people". So long as RTG gets its money, they can continue to operate, no matter how many players get cheated.
AS
------------------
TheAPage.com
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| Posted by: Jetset at February 22, 2002, 11:16 pm | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
And yet that owner might find him or herself between a rock and a hard place by not honoring the promo obligations to players who got in before the T&Cs were changed, thus antagonising them and driving business away.
The online gambling community, and particularly regular gamblers have learned to communicate ery effectively through the medium of message boards like this and the word gets around fast.
If the casino has misjudged or mismanaged their promo but the customers have played entirely within the promo T & C's the casino should take its medicine - not offer tidbits in consolation.
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| Posted by: playerdave at February 22, 2002, 8:56 pm | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
I got screwed by these guys too. I received the promotion and played extensively when it started. The first time they informed me of their new conditions was yesterday when they gave me merely a fraction of what they should have.
I had originally deposited $100. I had been up without any sort of bonus for quite a while. I was certainly profitable at this 210 hand point. Trying to get an AK blackjack however, I proceeded to lose that entire $100 deposit, and another $200 in additional deposits. This is what really gets me upset. I lost a lot of money that I otherwise would not have risked, trying to win a promotion that the change well after the fact. As it happens, I did get 2 AK blackjacks. When these occured, I have absolutely no idea, but they were apparently not within the first 210 hands.
Blast 21 owes me $2500. I now remember why I had stopped playing at RTG outfits for months. This is all too typical
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| Posted by: thecrawdaddy at February 22, 2002, 8:29 pm | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
I would like to add a couple things. First I only played that first night, before the casino changed the rules. The casino had told me that they would in fact honor all play for the enitre weekend because they stood behind their promotion. But I did not want to milk the system. I just wanted the money I'd already won fairly. I felt pretty good about that.
Second, Einstien, the casino made the rules, sent the rules to everyone on their Email list twice. If the rules changed the player advantage, well, they're a CASINO. Casino's understand how the games work better than any of us. It's not like I got bonus money for playing there, or had a coupon or something. I had to enter the casino, deposit my money, and play the game hoping to hit the right combination of cards to win money. I could've ery easily went bust on my deposit without hitting the right cards. In those two hourse, my balance went up and then down, and then finally I hit the magic combinations. And the casino told me twice I would be... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: einstein at February 22, 2002, 2:02 pm | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
For those who are not aware of this promotion, I can give you some further info. Basically they were supposed to pay arious bonuses for Blackjacks and gave the player a nearly 30% edge on $5 bets.
Anyone with common sense would know that they can not pay if they honor this promotion. I was actually glad to see that they changed the rules to limit the bonus to the first 210 hands. That is still a great promotion, with an EV of about $300.
Unfortunately they did not change the rules until after the promotion started, and many players were told that they will get the bonus unlimitedly if they started before the change of terms. That was their mistake. But again, any player with common sense should know that they can not get paid because the casino simply does not have the money to pay for a game with 30% player edge.
The casino did make a huge mistake. And the players were not wrong. But at least now the casino is honest and trying to make up for it with some compensation. They h... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: thecrawdaddy at February 22, 2002, 1:17 pm | | Topic: RTG Continues The Sham--Admits Lying To Players--Look out Merlin, here comes BLAST Forum: Winner Online |
Admittedly RTG has tried to clean up its act by paying old debts. In my case RTG owed me money from Merlin, most notably, Magic Oasis, and TVS. Most of those debts are now over six months old. Two have been paid. RTG has come on the board to tell customers that it's now cleaning up it's act, that you should be able to trust RTG casinos now. In light of that I went back to an RTG casino for the first time in months and months. I used to be a regular RTG player, only to find out that the RTG sham continues.
Actually I can't believe this problem is not already on this board. It's on other boards already.
I played at the BLAST21 casino for their Hearts Promotion which offered prizes of bonus money for particular types of BlackJacks (up to a $500 bonus for a blackjack with an Ace and King of hearts). After I played BLAST21 changed the rules of this promotion, but promised me--and others--that all play before the "change" would be honored. Specifically the customer support rep Alex... | | Read Entire Entry |
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