| Posted by: YoungPlayer1 at July 26, 2005, 9:48 pm | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
Usually odds are more important in limit than NL as the bets are smaller giving you good pot odds a hiogher % of the time.
Most important odds to know are odds to complete your flush, open ended straights. Now if u are open ended for a straight flush u will hit either one over 60% of the time.
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| Posted by: Jesus Lederer at July 26, 2005, 8:30 pm | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
Is not so tricky to understand xdmanx, remember the long discussion about odds in this thread. See this paragraph of the #30 post on that thread about implied odds. Itīs a little simple example:
Quote: Originally Posted by Jesus Lederer
You are on a flush draw on the turn so you need 4:1 pot odds to call. Your opponent bets offering you 3:1 pot odds. You probably think you should fold, but that can be a wrong move. Here is when implied odds acts. You have to anticipate the next betting round. If you catch your draw, maybe your opponent is going to call a bet on the river, so youīre anticipating 4:1 pot odds, which means a right call.
Did you understand?
Implied odds are all about anticipating your opponentīs move if you catch your draw.
Itīs not so hard to understand, but i still think that it would be a good idea to make an article about odds.
Anyway, i agree with you xdmanx that in poker you just have to apply the easiest and simpliest math you can, because ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: StackThemUp at July 26, 2005, 11:19 am | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
You think its too tricky to understand? I've re read it and i feel like i've done the best job...whats your own iew on that?
John
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| Posted by: StackThemUp at July 26, 2005, 5:54 am | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
Hi All,
One important thing to remember is 'implied odds'..for example say you hold A J clubs and the flop holds two clubs...you have 9 outs which you'll hit roughly 1.95/1 or 35% by the river or 4/1 or 19% on the turn or the river...the important thing in those figures is the turning of each card.. its all well and good knowing you've got 35% of hitting but that changes if someone bets out on the turn...35% only applies if the turn is checked which in all probability it isn't going to be. Your pot odds always need to be higher than your hand odds to make it pay so to get to the point...to work out if its worth a call...you must calculate your odds for each turning of the card so in this case its 4/1. To put this into context with $...
There is $180 in the pot and the flop comes with 'nut flush' draw..your oppenent bets out $20..do you call? The answer is yes..your getting 10/1 on your money and your hand odds are 4/1 to hit it on the turn. However if you think once you hit your draw y... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: xdmanx007 at July 26, 2005, 12:24 am | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by aceykc
hi there
i need some help in calculating my outs after the flop,as a percentage, to decide if to fold, call, raise.
i find this difficult to do online, wth the time constraints.
thanks
good luck on the tables
try leaving out converting to percentages I leave the numbers in raw odds form makes the math easier and works just the same.
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| Posted by: twizzybop at July 25, 2005, 10:05 pm | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
I know what diablo meant
The nuts can change absolutely by just 1 card or even 2.
I have the perfect scenario.. I played a hand that I don't almost ever play. Queen, 7 of clubs.. I called a persons 2X the BB bet with this hand. Flop comes 3 7's, Turn shows an Ace, while the river shown a 6. The guy kept betting like mad and I kept calling him. He shown that he had pocket aces giving him a full house. So I had the nuts the whole hand but what if another ace had come on the river?? My "Nuts" hand would be the 2nd best hand in this scenario.
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| Posted by: robwhufc at July 25, 2005, 8:30 pm | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by CutCard4
In my understanding, having the nuts means that you have the best possible hand using cards that are already in play. Having your opp drawing dead is the "absolute" nuts.
I've also heard it in reference to the best type of hand, such as the "nut flush", but the board shows a possible boat.
OK, in that case i'm wrong and i'm sorry. I just thought if you had the nuts you couldn't be beat.
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| Posted by: CutCard4 at July 25, 2005, 8:24 pm | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by robwhufc
Err? If a hand can be beaten it's not the nuts is it?
In my understanding, having the nuts means that you have the best possible hand using cards that are already in play. Having your opp drawing dead is the "absolute" nuts.
I've also heard it in reference to the best type of hand, such as the "nut flush", but the board shows a possible boat.
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| Posted by: robwhufc at July 25, 2005, 8:01 pm | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by diabloblanco
. Remember that the "nuts" can change with a new card. What may be the stone cold nuts on the flop, may be the second nuts or worse after the turn.
Err? If a hand can be beaten it's not the nuts is it?
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| Posted by: titans4ever at July 25, 2005, 7:48 pm | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
All i do is figure out the number of cards that can improve my hand and multiply by 2. You double that for the turn.
Example:
You have AQ clubs and then get the nut flush draw but don't hit a pair. You need to have one of the other 9 clubs for the nuts. 9x2=18, 18x2=36. You have a 36% (34.97% by calculator) chance to get the last club on the turn and river and about an 18% (19.57% by calculator) chance on the river alone.
If you feel getting another ace can help you out just do 12X2=24 and 24x2=48. by the calculator it is 44.96% and 26.09.
If you use a true calculator you can tell these are off a little but you can do it on the fly and quick. You eventually get a feel of how you need to move the number up or down slightly. I play mostly live games and it looks funny if you pull out an odds sheet or carry a calculator to the table.
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| Posted by: diabloblanco at July 25, 2005, 5:31 pm | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
The hardest problem for most people in the beginning is realizing all the factors they have to determine and doing it accurately.
You must calculate on the fly for each street:
1.) The absolute "nut" hand
2.) Your number of outs/The number of cards remaining
3.) And your pot odds
Knowing the nut hand is imparative because you can compare that hand to what you think your opponent may have. Remember that the "nuts" can change with a new card. What may be the stone cold nuts on the flop, may be the second nuts or worse after the turn. After a while you will begin to automatically calculate all the odds of hitting particular hands like it is second nature. Try not to become solely dependant on an odds calculator as it won't always be there for you. Use it as a tool, but not a nessesity.
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| Posted by: aceykc at July 25, 2005, 3:07 pm | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
Thanks
now i have no excuse
i must say this site and the members are proving ery helpful
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| Posted by: chicubs1616 at July 25, 2005, 2:54 pm | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
www.cardplayer.com has an odds converter...
To do it quickly in your head you take the number of cards that help you and divide them by the total number of unseen cards in the deck...
So if after the flop you have a flush draw...
9 cards help you to make your flush (13 - 2 on board - 2in your hand = 9) so you divide that by the total number of unseen cards (52 - 2 in your hand - 3 on flop = 47)
So in the next card you have a 9/47 chance in hitting the flush card or ~19%
To calculate odds for hitting a flush for example on the turn OR the river, yuo just add the two probabilities together...9/47 + 9/46 = ~39%
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| Posted by: Dorkus Malorkus at July 25, 2005, 10:36 am | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
No problem.
After a while you'll end up memorising the out %s, even if you have a crap memory like me.
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| Posted by: aceykc at July 25, 2005, 8:59 am | | Topic: outs? post flop Forum: Card Chat |
hi there
i need some help in calculating my outs after the flop,as a percentage, to decide if to fold, call, raise.
i find this difficult to do online, wth the time constraints.
thanks
good luck on the tables
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