| Posted by: Kundera at August 30, 2007, 12:43 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
I played a hand recently where I had - I think - second pair, an overcard and an up/down draw. Flop was checked, on the turn my opponent bet (I think with top pair and a weak or weakish kicker) and I called. On the river a 3rd suited card came down and I'd missed my straight draw. I was pretty sure i was beat at this point. However I bet fairly low (perhaps a third of the pot), a bet which made it seem obvious that I'd hit the flush and wanted my opponent to call. He folded.
With bluffing, sometimes opportunities just present themselves.
A common falacy, too, is that you've got to bet big to push someone off a pot. Sometimes the bets where it looks like you want your opponent to call are the ones most likely to get your opponent to lay down his hand.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: royalburrito24 at August 29, 2007, 10:06 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
ahh the art of the bluff, so hard to master, but for me the best part of the game
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: strongbower at August 29, 2007, 11:27 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
hehe, if your playing heads up and feel the need to bluff play every hand like limit poker
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: OzExorcist at August 29, 2007, 7:21 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by rob5775
Pretty general statement. Care to ELABORATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Bluffing in poker was banned in 2004 - didn't you get the memo?
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: starfall at August 28, 2007, 1:44 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
If you're relatively new to poker, then one thing to bear in mind is that the bluff is one of the most over-used tactics in poker, and can make for ery costly mistakes.
It's less about how much you bet (you want to be enough to put someone off, but not risk more than you need to or look like it's just trying to buy the pot, but the exact amount depends on your opponents and the table conditions and what kind of hand they have and more), and much more about psychology and position.
Being in late position gives you the advantage of being able to see if someone looks weak or not (and therefore how likely they are to fold to a bet), and the psychology comes in when you're trying to work out what kind of person they have and what kind of hand they're likely to have. Some people will rarely fold, especially on the river, and you'll have a hard time bluffing them. However, others will play ery tight, and will often fold when the flop misses them.
The other thing to be aware of is what the other ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: tigertight at August 28, 2007, 7:59 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
bluffing is a skill you just need to play with some one and let them tell you what to improve something that when you bluff to make you look confident in yourself and your hand something that will scare anyone away idk i read this in a book hope it helps see you in the poker room :P
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: pigpen02 at August 25, 2007, 4:53 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by aarogorn_
Don't think of it as bluffing, think of it as agressive play. Watch the players and do it more to the ones that have a pattern of betting only when they have something. If your in postition or close to being in good postition don't ever let anyone have a free card. I hear this often "If you bet or raise you have two ways to win"
If you go all in with 72o you have about one way to win.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: NightFun at August 25, 2007, 4:46 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by aarogorn_
Don't think of it as bluffing, think of it as agressive play. Watch the players and do it more to the ones that have a pattern of betting only when they have something. If your in postition or close to being in good postition don't ever let anyone have a free card. I hear this often "If you bet or raise you have two ways to win"
Great advice....I like this one
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: aarogorn_ at August 19, 2007, 6:35 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Don't think of it as bluffing, think of it as agressive play. Watch the players and do it more to the ones that have a pattern of betting only when they have something. If your in postition or close to being in good postition don't ever let anyone have a free card. I hear this often "If you bet or raise you have two ways to win"
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: NightFun at August 19, 2007, 1:27 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by cltownsend
I'm not that great at bluffing. Any suggestions on how to improve this skill?
*Christi
Hope this helps you out! and Good Luck!
"Poker is not just a mathematical game. It is also a game that entails a lot of psychological combat. Three of the most important psychological weapons in poker are Bluffing, Semi-Bluffing, and Slowplaying.
Bluffing
Bluffing is much more useful in a no-limit game than in a limit game. In a no-limit game, a player's entire stack is at risk each hand. In a limit game, players know they can only lose so much if they call to the river.
Bluffing is almost useless in a low-stakes limit game (anything less than $2-$4). Rarely will a hand not be called to showdown, so there is no point in scaring people out of the pot. Bluffing becomes a much more powerful tool at high-limit games. When you play at a higher limit, it's best to bluff when you 'represent' something and there ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: daxter70 at August 17, 2007, 10:51 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by Will Sidis
That's a good point. If the board looks scary to you, it probably also looks scary to your opponent. This is where postion can pay. If the board comes up AhKhQh, this can be a good situation to bluff if it is checked to you in a three/two handed situation.
Also, its important to remember to bluff mostly in headsup situations.
why BLUFF that board....JJ is callin u with no heart!!!
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: NightFun at August 17, 2007, 7:55 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Couldn't agree more!!! (about not being able to bluff in this game anymore!!)
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Will Sidis at August 17, 2007, 3:23 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by amygrantfan
i've found some players fold easier when there's an ace on the board. so i do know that it's easier to bluff if there's an ace up.
That's a good point. If the board looks scary to you, it probably also looks scary to your opponent. This is where postion can pay. If the board comes up AhKhQh, this can be a good situation to bluff if it is checked to you in a three/two handed situation.
Also, its important to remember to bluff mostly in headsup situations.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: MississippiMud at August 12, 2007, 6:46 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by cltownsend
I'm not that great at bluffing. Any suggestions on how to improve this skill?
*Christi
2 things that I pay particular attention to.
1) Know who the bad players are... the ones who will call seemingly at random or chase insane draws
2) Know what table image you are projecting to the players that show skills and are paying attention
Once you have those 2 figured out you can pick intelligent spots to bluff
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Inscore77 at August 12, 2007, 4:02 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Even though I posted my strategy earlier, no one style will work for one person. I've read many articles on bluffing and none of them worked for me. You have to develop your skill your own way. Ive been playing for 4 years and I'm just starting to get to where I can pull off some good bluffs. Practice makes perfect, and if you're going to bluff, your reads better be perfect.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: jeffred1111 at August 12, 2007, 2:16 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Post about MICRO games.
It is true that it is somewhat harder to bluff on the internet (and I'm talking about a stone cold bluff): people tend to chase and call even with 3 pair no kicker, even in PL or NL games. What does that teach us ? Unless we have ery good position (last to act after the flop), you are facing few opponents (2-3 max), the flop is ery dry and THE POT is also ery dry, we shouldn't attempt stone cold bluffs unless we know the opposing players is /are capable of folding. Since we need to bluff in order to increase our deceptiveness, it is better to do so in small pots than in big ones, since the pots don't get magically big (someone is bound to have a big hand that doesn't warrant a fold). When we go up in stakes, bluffing in big pots is a move that should be attempted more often. In micros, it won't work often enough to be +EV against a good portion of the opponents we will face.
On the other hand, we should semi-bluff (drawing to the nut with more than 10-12 good ou... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: ziggymom at August 12, 2007, 11:51 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
its hard to read people on line...bet higher ( big bet) ...if they still call you know they have something good.. gl
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: juju at August 12, 2007, 11:27 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Are we talking internet poker here or real poker? I always think its much harder on the internet because you don't get such a good read of your opponents.
It can be good to bluff boards with an ace on but remember the people likely to have called to see the flop are those likely to have high cards like aces.
Only other advice I can give is to know when your bluff has gone wrong. If you get raised you can often feel like there's too much in the pot for you to throw away but if you haven't got anything its best to lay your cards down. If you just try to bluff more you can get yourself into a lot of trouble.
Julian
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: amygrantfan at August 12, 2007, 7:57 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
i've found some players fold easier when there's an ace on the board. so i do know that it's easier to bluff if there's an ace up.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: naruto_miu at August 12, 2007, 7:27 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Well everyone just about sumed it up, i personally try to figure out the player first, put him/her into groups (per say). For instance if i know my player is loose then i wont try to bluff for the simple fact that he/she may have a weak pair and decide on calling just to see what u have, but if i feel this player is semi tight, and only comes in with nice starting hands, then i call because i'm trying to pull off a bluff on this person no matter the flop, unless it's a high flop, then nah cuz i'd figure this person connected due to his/her image at the table. Sry i can't be more help then that....
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: rachelrach at August 12, 2007, 5:00 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
It's hard, because you can't come across too weak or too aggressive. You have to find a happy medium where they think you're betting just enough to get them into the pot and making enough money off of the hand. That's what I try to do, and it works for me. But you have to have a good read on them because they just might have a good hand.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: rob5775 at August 12, 2007, 4:56 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by daxter70
U cant bluff in this game ANYMORE!!!!!!
Pretty general statement. Care to ELABORATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: rob5775 at August 12, 2007, 4:54 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by anquish
Thank you for catching the reference.
No sarcasm leaking through there.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Inscore77 at August 12, 2007, 3:40 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
When I go in on a bluff I usually bet 2 to 3 times the BB depending on my outs. If i get a call, I know that person might have a hand, or at least similar outs. I then play off the turn and river as to what I do next. If i hit, I will play the hand accordingly(sp). If I miss, I will either check if I think my oppenet has a strong hand, but if I think he is chasing or a weak player in general, I will lay down another bet.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: vanquish at August 12, 2007, 1:44 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by jeffred1111
I'm picturing the two cartoons from that Guiness commercial that kept syaing "Brilliant!" over and over again. Thank you for the laugh.
Thank you for catching the reference.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: jeffred1111 at August 11, 2007, 11:26 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by terrbear70
what i do is bet 100 if they just call then go for 250 if they still just call then take it up to 500 or more that has worked for me lots good luck dont hate the messenger if it dont work out lol
Brilliant!
I'm picturing the two cartoons from that Guiness commercial that kept syaing "Brilliant!" over and over again. Thank you for the laugh.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: amygrantfan at August 11, 2007, 10:57 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
gotta get a good read of your opponent. if they have a strong hand, continually raising your bet means you will just lose more money.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: vanquish at August 11, 2007, 10:42 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by terrbear70
what i do is bet 100 if they just call then go for 250 if they still just call then take it up to 500 or more that has worked for me lots good luck dont hate the messenger if it dont work out lol
Brilliant!
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: terrbear70 at August 11, 2007, 9:33 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
what i do is bet 100 if they just call then go for 250 if they still just call then take it up to 500 or more that has worked for me lots good luck dont hate the messenger if it dont work out lol
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: jeffred1111 at August 6, 2007, 2:39 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Read Dorkus' article and then the bluffing and semi-bluffing in TOP (The Theory of Poker): it will give you a rough idea of how you can include bluffing into your game. But, in my mind, you cannot be bad at bluffing, you can only be bad at reading hands/flop, remembering bet patterns, picking your spots: bluffing is not a skill per se, it is a mix of different skills that leads to the decision to bluff and how to do so.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Dorkus Malorkus at August 5, 2007, 7:46 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Obligatory pimpage for an article I wrote a while ago.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: cltownsend at August 5, 2007, 7:42 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
I'm not that great at bluffing. Any suggestions on how to improve this skill?
*Christi
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: KerouacsDog at January 7, 2007, 1:43 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by stormswa
yes if I had big breatisisisisis I would go naked if they let me, poker is about one thing and that is winning money. I would use anything they allow me to take advantage.
ah, I have big breasts, but they rest on my beer gut quite nicely, and they distract in a different way.................ie a man with breasts, what kind of freak is he!!!!!!!!!!!
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: stormswa at January 7, 2007, 12:09 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by KerouacsDog
if we're gonna talk about pro's and how they play, then do you follow Jennifer Tilly's(wowee!) advice of,'displaying cleavage to distract the other players'?
Let's not throw pro's into this argument, A pro is just a poker player with more money than us.
KD
yes if I had big breatisisisisis I would go naked if they let me, poker is about one thing and that is winning money. I would use anything they allow me to take advantage.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: KerouacsDog at January 7, 2007, 10:35 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by stormswa
how did this get this far, I was just telling you what a professional poker player wrote about it. He wrote exactly what I said that mixing up play is playing different hands same ways and not same hands different ways.
I think we can just end this silly debate now that I think is pretty much done with.
if we're gonna talk about pro's and how they play, then do you follow Jennifer Tilly's(wowee!) advice of,'displaying cleavage to distract the other players'?
Let's not throw pro's into this argument, A pro is just a poker player with more money than us.
KD
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: KerouacsDog at January 7, 2007, 10:31 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by c9h13no3
How can you get that kind of information on the first hand of a tournament? Also, the reward you stand to gain from stealing my blind is usually quite low that early. Thus, the risk isn't justified. Waiting until later in the tournament when you have more information on your opponents & there's an ante will almost always make more sense.
i agree woith your second sentence entirely.
but, if i play my usual MTT i start with 2000 chips, with blinds 20/40. In the first half hour, Im willing to risk a quarter of my stack(500 chips) to identify, a)who Im up against, b)who are sharks, who are fish, and c) what styles people are, LAP, LAG, TAG, TAP, ETC. .
Poker is a lot about information, if I get that early, then I believe I have an advantage.
My biggest freeroll win is a 2000 player at Absolute, took me 6 hours to take it down, and that was purely down to a mixture of luck, instinct, reads, bluffs, LAG-play, TAG-play, and my chos... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Styrofoam at January 6, 2007, 5:29 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by c9h13no3
How can you get that kind of information on the first hand of a tournament? Also, the reward you stand to gain from stealing my blind is usually quite low that early. Thus, the risk isn't justified. Waiting until later in the tournament when you have more information on your opponents & there's an ante will almost always make more sense.
it is easy... if the checks around to you and you're in position, you can be reasonably sure that you can take the pot down.... on the first hand.... playing strong aggressive poker throughout the tourney is what wins it. Every chip matters.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: stormswa at January 6, 2007, 12:42 pm | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by c9h13no3
How can you get that kind of information on the first hand of a tournament? Also, the reward you stand to gain from stealing my blind is usually quite low that early. Thus, the risk isn't justified. Waiting until later in the tournament when you have more information on your opponents & there's an ante will almost always make more sense.
thats what I said earlier in thread. +rep for saying what I said.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: c9h13no3 at January 6, 2007, 8:08 am | | Topic: bluffing Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by KerouacsDog
If I believe I can do a blind-steal bluff first hand of a tourney I will attempt it.
How can you get that kind of information on the first hand of a tournament? Also, the reward you stand to gain from stealing my blind is usually quite low that early. Thus, the risk isn't justified. Waiting until later in the tournament when you have more information on your opponents & there's an ante will almost always make more sense.
| | Static Link |
|