| Posted by: popcash at July 25, 2006, 7:33 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Isn't it odd how all of you defenders of the sites are doing nothing but winning on line? Yeah, right. I'd love to meet any one of you at a cash table some time.
You've convinced me of one thing, though... for the most part this forum is frequented by a bunch of flamers. I'm sure you'll all be happy to see me leave, so good bye. The insults you fling from this point on will be a waste of time... I'll not be back.
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| Posted by: Bombjack at July 25, 2006, 6:53 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Well popcash, sounds like you've got some pretty explosive evidence building up here. Has it been published yet? If not, you can make a fortune selling it to a national magazine or newspaper. Imagine the headlines! I look forward to reading about "The Great Online Poker Scam" in the near future.
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| Posted by: Fish at July 25, 2006, 6:21 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by popcash
I live in Vegas and I've been playing poker for a ery long time (way before it was cool)
Are you that old nit that demanded the dealer give a new setup every time your small pocket pair didn't hold up ?
Quote: Originally Posted by popcash
recording our cards for 500 hands each session, playing to the river each hand to see the full compliment of community cards.
As a computer programmer you should have some sort of basic math background.
What can you tell me about a sample size of 500 hands?
What can you tell me about a sample size of 10,000 hands?
You probably can't, so I will answer for you:
VARIANCE. YOUR SAMPLE SIZE IS TOOOOOOOOO SMALLL!!!!!!!!
Quote: Originally Posted by popcash
I'll be out here in la-la land playing and winning at live poker.
I like it just fine here in normal land where I can win at live poker also, and where I can Play4-6 tables online... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: popcash at July 25, 2006, 6:13 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
whyareunvs... that's a nice, well thought out posting. I respect that. In response...
1. What motivation is there to rig the deck?
Again, not talking about rigging the deck, simply avoiding lack-luster shuffles. Motivation is to provide excitement to keep players coming back and to speed up play. Thought that was clear in my previous postings.
2. I've seen 1000's of hands folded to a single moderate raise. This is not consistent with a desire to increase action flops.
My findings were not with starting hands but with online hands played out to the river ersus our software simulations. Our arious randomization algorithms didn't even come close to producing as many final monster hands as online shuffles did... somewhere in the neighborhood of 1/6th as many.
3. The number of monster hands is stictly based on the number of hands per hour.
??? How do you figure that? We run a 500 hand simulation and compare it to 500 online hands... where does time come i... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: whyareunvs at July 25, 2006, 5:20 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by joosebuck
How come no one ever notices the 4 hour sessions where the table never sees better than a flush?
joosebuck --
I was playing in the Caesars boat outside Louisville, KY and in a matter of 3 hours, saw quads 4 times, at that same table and three of those four it was 7's. It happens everywhere both the long droughts and the long streaks. Online your number of hands per hour is so high that you're going to see it much more often.
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| Posted by: whyareunvs at July 25, 2006, 5:18 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by popcash
Anyone who thinks the online shuffles are rigged is half right. They are actually random, however the site software evaluates every shuffle to see if there are enough strong hands to make the game exciting and bring conflict to the game. If not, the shuffle is discarded and the next random shuffle is produced. That's why there are so many monster hands in online poker. The sites want quick and fatal conflicts to speed up play... the faster your game or tourney is over, the more games they can run ($$$). The more monster hands out there, the more excitement. If online poker used every single random shuffle produced by the software, it would be so boring no one would play.
These are the simple facts of online play... we simply have to accept it or quit playing.
I would disagree with this post for a few primary reasons --
1. What motivation is there to rig the deck? In almost all limits you're going to cap the rake and yes numb... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: MrSticker at July 25, 2006, 4:44 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by popcash
Anyone who thinks the online shuffles are rigged is half right. They are actually random, however the site software evaluates every shuffle to see if there are enough strong hands to make the game exciting and bring conflict to the game. If not, the shuffle is discarded and the next random shuffle is produced. That's why there are so many monster hands in online poker. The sites want quick and fatal conflicts to speed up play... the faster your game or tourney is over, the more games they can run ($$$). The more monster hands out there, the more excitement. If online poker used every single random shuffle produced by the software, it would be so boring no one would play.
These are the simple facts of online play... we simply have to accept it or quit playing.
You mean there's no bluffing in online poker because every "shuffle" has "strong hands"? Thank God! Now I can throw away everything but my Aces and Kings. Th... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Dorkus Malorkus at July 25, 2006, 4:28 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by popcash
I'm not posting all this to start some big fight. Take it any way you like. As for me, I'll be out here in la-la land playing and winning at live poker. No offense to any of you fine players out there.
...and I'll be here playing and winning at online poker. Take care.
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| Posted by: popcash at July 25, 2006, 4:23 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
It's really interesting how quick you all are to defend the poker sites.
First, let me clarify... I didn't say the sites are rigged. I said they use selective shuffling (there's a big difference). There's nothing illegal about selective shuffling and the sites have nothing to worry about from former employees "exposing" anything. Selective shuffles ARE random... they don't decide who wins or loses... they just guarantee lots of exciting hands and lots of conflict, keeping players in hands so someone will take a beat.
I live in Vegas and I've been playing poker for a ery long time (way before it was cool) in cash games and tournaments all over town. I'm also a programmer by trade and have written quite a few shuffling and poker simulation routines since online poker went big. In addition, 5 of my friends and I have run 6 separate experiments where we played at the same online table, recording our cards for 500 hands each session, playing to the river each hand to see the full ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: wsorbust at July 25, 2006, 2:56 am | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
So ummmm.
Let's pretend for just a second we live in la-la land and what you say is true.
Exactly what happens when a programmer for this 'action-packed' poker site decides to leave?
Do they pay him off, or just kill him?
Kill 'em of course...
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| Posted by: Fish at July 25, 2006, 12:01 am | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by popcash
Anyone who thinks the online shuffles are rigged is half right. They are actually random, however the site software evaluates every shuffle to see if there are enough strong hands to make the game exciting and bring conflict to the game. If not, the shuffle is discarded and the next random shuffle is produced. That's why there are so many monster hands in online poker. The sites want quick and fatal conflicts to speed up play... the faster your game or tourney is over, the more games they can run ($$$). The more monster hands out there, the more excitement. If online poker used every single random shuffle produced by the software, it would be so boring no one would play.
These are the simple facts of online play... we simply have to accept it or quit playing.
So ummmm.
Let's pretend for just a second we live in la-la land and what you say is true.
Exactly what happens when a programmer for this 'action-packed' poker site deci... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: combuboom at July 24, 2006, 11:12 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by popcash
Anyone who thinks the online shuffles are rigged is half right. They are actually random, however the site software evaluates every shuffle to see if there are enough strong hands to make the game exciting and bring conflict to the game. If not, the shuffle is discarded and the next random shuffle is produced. That's why there are so many monster hands in online poker. The sites want quick and fatal conflicts to speed up play... the faster your game or tourney is over, the more games they can run ($$$). The more monster hands out there, the more excitement. If online poker used every single random shuffle produced by the software, it would be so boring no one would play.
These are the simple facts of online play... we simply have to accept it or quit playing.
*head explodes*
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| Posted by: Bombjack at July 24, 2006, 10:53 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by popcash
Anyone who thinks the online shuffles are rigged is half right. They are actually random, however the site software evaluates every shuffle to see if there are enough strong hands to make the game exciting and bring conflict to the game. If not, the shuffle is discarded and the next random shuffle is produced. That's why there are so many monster hands in online poker. The sites want quick and fatal conflicts to speed up play... the faster your game or tourney is over, the more games they can run ($$$). The more monster hands out there, the more excitement. If online poker used every single random shuffle produced by the software, it would be so boring no one would play.
These are the simple facts of online play... we simply have to accept it or quit playing.
Popcash you are talking out of your bottom, this is not a "fact", you just made it up. The "poker sites are rigged" debate has been done to death and no-one'... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: popcash at July 24, 2006, 9:13 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Anyone who thinks the online shuffles are rigged is half right. They are actually random, however the site software evaluates every shuffle to see if there are enough strong hands to make the game exciting and bring conflict to the game. If not, the shuffle is discarded and the next random shuffle is produced. That's why there are so many monster hands in online poker. The sites want quick and fatal conflicts to speed up play... the faster your game or tourney is over, the more games they can run ($$$). The more monster hands out there, the more excitement. If online poker used every single random shuffle produced by the software, it would be so boring no one would play.
These are the simple facts of online play... we simply have to accept it or quit playing.
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| Posted by: troyt2006 at March 22, 2005, 9:04 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Ya Ive come to notice that many freerolls always high stack you it seems. I think they give the people with the higher stacks the better cards to make the tournament go faster.
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| Posted by: RAZE at March 22, 2005, 7:53 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
The only real edge I've discovered (because of the overall randomness of poker), is to be extremely selective about seating..i.e., never sitting in front of the largest stack, wait for seats to open that u want, etc. In a tourney, you get what what you get so you have to adjust your approach dramatically if you get an unfavorable seat. Also, I search for players that are loose by name. I record them in the search for feature after I've watched them squander and call all the way down for who knows what reason, then search for them when i play live $ to exploit that advantage. If you collect like 20 of them, you always have a target instead of wandering aimlessly.
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| Posted by: Thewebmaster at February 26, 2005, 4:39 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by darkhose30
at some sites ive noticed that it mostly depends on what seat ur sitting in they same to get all the good cards early and then again late on in games maybe it just me im not sure
It could be something and nothing but at some poker rooms I do seem to do better at certain seats, i've been sat on the right hand side of the table and got nothing but winning hands, been moved over to the left on another table and got nothing, over the course of a game being moved around 15 times this happened every time I was moved, if I got the right I did good, if I got the left I just folded, it's just how it happens sometimes.
In regards to the topic in question I have also been on both sides of this, one particular time was just last week, I was playing a "sit-n-go" tourney, only for $2.00 and I hit the winning hand 14 times in a row, one person even accused me of working for the site, it was ery unreal. The prime example in this particu... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: DeucesAreWild at February 20, 2005, 7:48 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Yah, I have seem some pretty shady call by the large stacks and they always seem to win in online games. Like they'll be chasing straights, or flushes. I had one experience where i had pocket kings in a heads up the ery first hand. The guy I was playing went all in, in an attempt to steal my blind. So I called. HE had 8, 9 suited in spades. On the flop came a King, and two other cards, one which was a spade. The turn and the river were spades and he ended up beating my three kings with a flush. It was complete bullocks..
-Deuce
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| Posted by: Stokenut at February 20, 2005, 6:42 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
it always happens in freerolls cos it iant hteir money they are playing with. but they tend to stop playing stupid when the money places come closer and then they play for real. At this point they get tight too, good tiem to blind steal
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| Posted by: poolmaster at February 20, 2005, 5:53 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
I can feel the pain. As a math teacher, still have to believe in the odds and luck, it just happens, a few weeks back on noble, I had in 4 straight hands, AA, KK, AA and AKo, it was unreal (naturally, I won LOTS!), of course it was only a tournament so didn't take some real cash on them.
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| Posted by: darkhorse30 at February 20, 2005, 4:17 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
at some sites ive noticed that it mostly depends on what seat ur sitting in they same to get all the good cards early and then again late on in games maybe it just me im not sure
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| Posted by: JamaicanYardy at February 20, 2005, 3:20 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
aww man i would be pissed, when i playa t the casino i dont get bad beats because they actually shuffle cards good online its all numbers n shit some of them dont have the proper math n sometimes it favor a player
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| Posted by: Ice76 at February 20, 2005, 3:02 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Yesterday I went in with AKo in a game irl. Flop came AA8. I started betting and 'til the river it was a guy and me. There was no flush, no straight, and I had trips with K high. Thought I had it. He shows me... pocket 8's.
Very next hand I was left shortstacked. Got Q9s, went in. Flop came QQ3. I went all-in. Same guy called. Turn came J, river came another 3. He had pocket 3's.
Right after he got me out he got 3 guys out in a 4-way all-in Q-high flush s K-high flush s A-high flush s his full house.
Hell, and I was the damn croupier.
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| Posted by: lyon21 at February 20, 2005, 1:02 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
Yeah online u seem to get a lot of bad beats but i cant say to much as i have never played it at a casino just on the net.
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| Posted by: sss2005 at February 19, 2005, 8:27 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
I've been on both sides of this situation. Poker's a game with MANY ups and downs, good streaks and bad ones. I guess that's what makes it so much fun.
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| Posted by: Payout at February 19, 2005, 5:13 pm | | Topic: Anyone else notice this? Forum: Card Chat |
OK, everyone claims poker sites are fair. I mean why would you put money into something you thought was unfair? Maybe cause you trust the word of the site director? Has anyone ever noticed this. You come into a table, there is maybe 1 or 2 large stacks. One is an aggersive player ery, calls everything raises everything, pushes as hard as they can but always seems to catch. I try to believe it's a flip of the coin but sometimes I just can't accept that as a reason as to why everytime I call this person they hit it. Luck or not, I've noitced it more at freerolls or play money. Person calls big stack raises person next re-raises then big stack just goes all in and the lotto players join him and he wins. I sat at a table for 30 mins and every other hand the big stack got the pot putting him at like 60k I believe. Or what about all the quads and the fullhouses, I mean maybe it's just me but I find it so odd there can be so many, how can one player catch 4 boats in a 30 min period? Two of them were back to ba... | | Read Entire Entry |
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