| Posted by: joosebuck at July 29, 2006, 1:08 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
1) Poker Site figures out how to detect your bot, ban you
only bots in memory will be found, not one run from another PC as hurricaine said. a lot of cheats for online games run the same way. detectable on the pc, but using packet sniffing software and custom made programs that act on a 2nd box make it nigh-invulnerable to detection
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Freakakanus at July 29, 2006, 12:51 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by Hurricane09
Why dont we propose Freakakanus s the Bot - we could make a movie!
I'm not sure if I should be flattered or insulted....LOL
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: NANUNANU at July 28, 2006, 11:43 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
First, the person who started this thread DOES NOT really care about the game of poker. Yes this is cheating!!!! You are cheating the game of poker, and you're cheating yourself. I dont let my buddy gamble with my money online even though he is a ery good player and this fool lets some preprogrammed bot play his money. Unless this BOT knows all the hole cards of the other players it will lose more than it wins. Like the reply of the other member AI doesnt hold a candle to a human player. I cant believe someone would admit to this...lol....lol ....unreal. I dont care if people do this pathetic poker bot crap, but it makes me a little mad because I respect the game of poker and so do alot of others and I think it just rubs us the wrong way. Well, gl all that really do play this game...lol
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: wsorbust at July 28, 2006, 9:45 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
Guys, QUIT PLAYING ONLINE. Online is full of players like the guy who started this thread.
Thank you, really, but your first post in a poker forum is telling people not to play? ? ? bah! People might be using them, but they sure as hell don't know how. ...I think I'll play.
Quote:
whatever happened to morals?
America Lost its morals around the time Britney Spears put out her first ideo! whoooo!
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Bombjack at July 28, 2006, 5:44 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Without wanting to sound too much like an old fuddy-duddy, whatever happened to morals? Don't you have any, odds_maker? It seems like you're hiding behind the anonymity of the internet, which you think makes it OK to be a cheat because no-one knows who you really are. But I don't think it makes a difference: it's the same act of cheating as if you were doing it at your home game, and you should be just as ashamed.
It's also ery bad sportsmanship.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: ChuckTs at July 28, 2006, 5:26 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by odds_maker
I'm actually ery profitable online and at the casino. I wouldn't automate bad play. LOL. I'm from another forum but need an opinion without anyone knowing who I am. I don't think it's cheating. It doesn't share card information with other poker bots. It just plays like it would if I was there. It doesn't make much, maybe one big blind per hour. I probably make more as I read players well.
What fish meant was that what you are doing is against the rules at most (if not all) sites.
They will confiscate your bankroll or your winnings if they find out, which they inevitably will.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: spore at July 28, 2006, 5:26 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
I really don't like the idea of these "bots". Computer AI in its current state is not anywhere near the point where it can come close to being able to play poker exactly like you do. There's always those "gut instincts", getting a feel for how other players play, etc.. that human element that computers cannot replicate... and probably won't come close to for a LONG time.
So yeah, you can tell it how to play ague scenarios, it can try and guess what players have by the way they've played previous hands. But in the end, it's just not a good idea. One of the biggest problems with these bots is that it has to log a lot of hands from a lot of players... yes, it gets smarter as it goes. But by that point, you have become a ery predictible player to those that have played against "you" for a long enough period of time. They will be able to figure out your thresholds for bets to call. Yes you can just play random tables all the time, but then your bot doesn't have much inf... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Beriac at July 28, 2006, 5:22 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
This is clearly cheating. The first, most obvious, and least disputable reason is that it's against the rules of the major poker sites, and so by definition it's cheating to them, the final arbiters of whether your cash gets confiscated.
You're using tools that are strictly against the rules to give yourself an advantage (correct play that doesn't get tired or go on tilt, or simply the ability to play more tables or play while you're napping or cheating at something else) at the expense of other players.
Honestly, the moral ambiguity required to question whether this is cheating is substantial.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Hurricane09 at July 28, 2006, 4:58 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
I'm a programmer by day and I've looked at these bots in the past. You get past the poker rooms because they run on a PC other than the one with the poker software on it. Thats the easy part. If the rest of it was so easy then everyone would do it. There is so much coding involved to create a successful bot that you would have a hard time really making any money. If yours is averaging a blind an hour, then you are doing well, and kudos to you. Personally I've seen a lot of the guys here play online and they have nothing to worry about because I highly doubt the average Joe could program a bot to play every circumstance and I like to make money, so I would welcome them at my table. There is so much more to the game than just position and the cards that are showing. Why dont we propose Freakakanus s the Bot - we could make a movie!
Mod edit - please do not link to software that is banned by poker sites. ~DM
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Dorkus Malorkus at July 28, 2006, 4:50 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Even with PT/PAHUD/whatever, ultimately a human is still actually playing the game. Comparing something like PT with using a bot is a ridiculous, self-serving attempt to justify what you're doing.
And, here's the crux of the matter, using bots is against the Terms of Service of the site you're playing on (note also that PT/PAHUD/etc aren't against the ToS). Therefore it is cheating, as the site is providing a service to you, under the agreement that, among other things, you will not use 'bot' software. You are therefore 'cheating' the site, and 'cheating' other players who (a) adhere to the Terms of Service, and (b) expect all others whom they play with to adhere to the Terms of Service.
I see this as undisputable, and any attempt by yourself to somehow classify it as not cheating is in my opinion, as I've already said, just a weak attempt to justify your actions.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: odds_maker at July 28, 2006, 4:26 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
For the guys that say this a form of cheating, do you consider all the other programs that help you cheating? Odds Calculators, Tracking Players, etc. If not then what is your reasoning. They still help you and that is not meant to be.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: odds_maker at July 28, 2006, 4:20 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
You must not be making ery much. At decent stakes, I'd be shocked if everyone was so stupid that there wouldn't be someone who could take advantage of a completely automated, predictable player. Play at my table any time, please.
Right now I'm not making much. Less than one big blind per hour (around $5). There are just so many bad players online that it's not hard to make money if you stay tight, play your cards, play your position, and don't bluff that much.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Bombjack at July 28, 2006, 3:40 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
I don't know, I think collusion is probably easier in live games, where people are more likely to know eachother, can soft play, squeeze, manipulate the deck, and signal to each other.
Although I would be a bit worried about collusion in high stakes Omaha games, where most of the deck is dealt out and the stakes are worth the attentions of organized crime. In the $10 Sit and Goes I play, I don't think it's an issue at all.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: gammon34 at July 28, 2006, 2:48 pm | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Guys, QUIT PLAYING ONLINE. Online is full of players like the guy who started this thread. I personaly get better results if I play myself than having a bot play for me (thats plain stupid, half of poker is reading other players).
The real problem is players playing with each other. Collusion!
You can not stop that or do anything about it, except starting to play live games like the game is supposed to play.
Cheers,
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Bombjack at July 28, 2006, 11:32 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
This is one reason I can't see PartyGammon real money tables taking off. It's too easy to get a computer or standalone machine to calculate the optimal moves.
What they don't mention in this article is that the Vex Bot has only mastered the heads-up game. Multi-way is a lot more complicated.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: shortstacked at July 28, 2006, 11:22 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
found this on another site
Quote:
They're worse than poker sharks. They've taken over online poker rooms everywhere. In fact, they're most likely sitting next to you at the table right now. They probably have most of your chips. Emotion doesn't get in their way. Neither does greed, exhaustion, or fear. Their tells are nil and, try as you might, you cannot put them on tilt. They're poker bots, and rumor has it, they're fleecing you bare.
Poker bots are computer programs set up to play on behalf of (and instead of) an actual human being, according to a consistent and, presumably, proven strategy. Hearing of the possible presence of these borderline cheaters in your online poker rooms could be enough to make online poker players question whether to sit down at the online poker tables at all.
So let's start there. In a word: yes. Of course you should keep playing poker. As we'll explain, these poker bots are far from foolproof and even farther from unbeatable. Second... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: wsorbust at July 28, 2006, 9:22 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
You must not be making ery much.
You can take a look at an article below about a ery successful bot that was programmed and ran on its own....
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6002298/
Poker sites might ban you for it because it's against their rules, but, is using an automated system really cheating? I can see the reasoning in believing that your mind is an automated system/strategy... and as for poker sites having "access to your harddrive", they might be able to see what programs you have hooked in with their poker client, but I'd say that's about it...except for Prima of course. If you run a spyware program it'll show them as being, if I can remember correctly, a trojan. No software runs "hidden", you might think it does, but it doesnt...it has to be running somewhere, somehow, in some sort of state. It's just a matter of time until they figure out what exactly you've got attached to them.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: combuboom at July 28, 2006, 8:31 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
You must not be making ery much. At decent stakes, I'd be shocked if everyone was so stupid that there wouldn't be someone who could take advantage of a completely automated, predictable player. Play at my table any time, please.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Fish at July 28, 2006, 2:48 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by odds_maker
The software runs hidden...I'm not worried about detection and cash out every week.
So do it Then.
But it would really be appreciated if you could post what happens on one of the major forums after it hits the fan.
And if it doesn't happen, Then Good on you!
Just be sure to mix up your play in this program. Because they will catch you.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: odds_maker at July 28, 2006, 2:48 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
Is this something like Texas Calculatem?I dont think I quite understand what program your using......is it an odds calculater???????
It's not like Texas Calculatem...it does play proper odds though. I have added an aggressiveness factor to it.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: odds_maker at July 28, 2006, 2:44 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
Why don't you just put a disguise on your friend, send him to your next live tourney, and have him play like you & say he's you. Same thing because IT'S NOT YOU PLAYING! No matter how you program it, it aint you.
I would if I could.
Quote:
The poker sites have access to your harddrive.
They know what you are running when you have the poker client running.
This type of program is against their T&Cs.
They will close your account. They will confiscate ALL the money in that account.
The software runs hidden...I'm not worried about detection and cash out every week.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Fish at July 28, 2006, 2:16 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by odds_maker
I'm actually ery profitable online and at the casino. I wouldn't automate bad play. LOL. I'm from another forum but need an opinion without anyone knowing who I am. I don't think it's cheating. It doesn't share card information with other poker bots. It just plays like it would if I was there. It doesn't make much, maybe one big blind per hour. I probably make more as I read players well.
I don't doubt you are profitable or not.
And I understand that you will make this program play almost identical to your true play.
So let's analyze it:
Do I think this is a good idea?
Yes. I do.
Will it work?
Yes it will. (or it should if you do it right)
So what's the problem?
The poker sites have access to your harddrive.
They know what you are running when you have the poker client running.
This type of program is against their T&Cs.
They will close your account. They will confiscate ALL th... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: MrSticker at July 28, 2006, 2:05 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by Freakakanus
No, I really honestly don't think I would. Maybe I'm the stupid one but I really think it stinks what you are doing.
Welcome to the forum, stay if you like... but you may want to go back to your other forum where cheating must be considered cool.
Nah, they probably think it's cheating, too. He's just looking for someone else to agree with him.
Why don't you just put a disguise on your friend, send him to your next live tourney, and have him play like you & say he's you. Same thing because IT'S NOT YOU PLAYING! No matter how you program it, it aint you.
Now I am being harsh. I still welcome you to the forum, but what you are talking about is serious and is one of the reasons they are trying to ban online poker in the US. Probably best to drop the subject, bud.
How 'bout them Dodgers? Do you like baseball?
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Freakakanus at July 28, 2006, 1:41 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by odds_maker
Would you automate play if you were successful. I guess Earthlings aren't that smart. JK Thanks for the welcome.
No, I really honestly don't think I would. Maybe I'm the stupid one but I really think it stinks what you are doing.
Welcome to the forum, stay if you like... but you may want to go back to your other forum where cheating must be considered cool.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Freakakanus at July 28, 2006, 1:37 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Taking the human element out of the game is not playing poker. It's just well.....cheating.
Besides what fun is it to let a computer make all the decisions for you?
Don't you have the skill to win your own money?
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: odds_maker at July 28, 2006, 1:36 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
Sorry, but it's 100% cheating. Welcome to Planet Earth. What planet are you from where it isn't cheating?
(Not to be harsh, but I just thought this^^ sounded cool. Welcome to the forum.)
Would you automate play if you were successful. I guess Earthlings aren't that smart. JK Thanks for the welcome.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: odds_maker at July 28, 2006, 1:32 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
I think you will be making a lot of posts in the near future.
They will be along the lines of : Grrr Party Took all my money! Wahhh Wahhh!
I don't understand why! Grrrrr Wahhh Wahh.
So good luck with that.
I'm actually ery profitable online and at the casino. I wouldn't automate bad play. LOL. I'm from another forum but need an opinion without anyone knowing who I am. I don't think it's cheating. It doesn't share card information with other poker bots. It just plays like it would if I was there. It doesn't make much, maybe one big blind per hour. I probably make more as I read players well.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: goffman73 at July 28, 2006, 1:27 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Is this something like Texas Calculatem?I dont think I quite understand what program your using......is it an odds calculater???????
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: MrSticker at July 28, 2006, 1:18 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Sorry, but it's 100% cheating. Welcome to Planet Earth. What planet are you from where it isn't cheating?
(Not to be harsh, but I just thought this^^ sounded cool. Welcome to the forum.)
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: Fish at July 28, 2006, 1:14 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by odds_maker
I have been using software that automates my poker play. A friend of mine told me that that is bad..err unethical or cheating i guess but i don't think so. It doesn't cheat in any way. I just configure what hands to play preflop and how to play postflop on what i flopped. I have been successful using it but he says that's cheating. I don't think so. What do you guys think?
I think you will be making a lot of posts in the near future.
They will be along the lines of : Grrr Party Took all my money! Wahhh Wahhh!
I don't understand why! Grrrrr Wahhh Wahh.
So good luck with that.
| | Static Link |
| Posted by: odds_maker at July 28, 2006, 1:00 am | | Topic: Need another opinion Forum: Card Chat |
I have been using software that automates my poker play. A friend of mine told me that that is bad..err unethical or cheating i guess but i don't think so. It doesn't cheat in any way. I just configure what hands to play preflop and how to play postflop on what i flopped. I have been successful using it but he says that's cheating. I don't think so. What do you guys think?
| | Static Link |
|