| Posted by: shinedown.45 at October 16, 2006, 3:46 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by OneMoreBust
So I have no legal right to money collected under false pretenses? Party can say, join this table, extra rake will go to a tournament, and then keep that when things dont work out when it was obvious there was a risk of that?
I just wish all of you had worked hard to get a pass into the Final and could get some real perspective on this, instead of telling me I should be glad that Party ripped me off.
Like I had said, It's my opinion and In no way am I saying that you should just let it go. Take the good advice and go with it, and I wish you luck on your endevor.
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| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 16, 2006, 2:26 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by wsorbust
This isn't nice either. Let's try a little harder to respond to posts in a classy manner.
You might want to work on that yourself.
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| Posted by: wsorbust at October 16, 2006, 8:30 am | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
Im sorry, I thought this is a Poker forum? Where many people would be aware of legal or other options I can take. I was actually given a few good pieces of advice from some people here, the best of which was to contact the gaming commission that is over sites like Party.
If you believe it is good advice, fine. That's your opinion. I'm not saying it is or isn't.
Quote:
So this clearly was a good place to post a question, and thus I did receive some worthy advice from people who don't have a law degree.
Clearly you're confused.lol You play(ed) at Party Poker and your senses are or have been numbed. You cannot differentiate good advice from bad advice from amateur poker players (I'm not saying it's good or bad). Some of which probably aren't even legal age to gamble in the states. It's nothing personal. You shouldn't have quoted me and used that harsh bold font in a fuedal attempt to berate me, I surely wasnt. Advice is advice. Oh, and th... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 15, 2006, 8:00 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Thanks Gman.
Yeah, Im a realist, I already have written off getting it back, but I'd at least like Party to get their wrists slapped for this.
There are many others on another forum who have been affected my this, so we will be contacting everyone we can to at least have this brought to attention to some regulatory bodies.
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| Posted by: GL (G-man) at October 15, 2006, 5:39 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
OneMoreBust,
While not a lawyer myself I am a qualified Accountant in which I have covered arious areas of the law. bubbasbestbabe has put it best really, you are enitiled to the money owed by Partypoker as far as I am concerned however to get it, most likely you would pay more than the sum itself in legal fees. Also like someone else said the gaming commission would most probably disregard the issue unless a sizeable number of people complained in which case they may look into it. I understand how you feel and it's the principle of the thing more than anything that would upset me.
Take the money, uninstall Party and use Pokerstars
G-man
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| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 15, 2006, 3:29 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by bubbasbestbabe
OMB, they are offering you $1800. You feel you are entitled to more. If this is the case then more than likely you will find a lawyer who will be willing to take your case. But take in considereation, how much more money are you talking about for yourself? You say $10,000. Okay fair enough. Now let's look at the big picture here.
From how you are posting I will say that you are from a country that is not home to party poker. You want to know if there is legal recourse for your situation. Of course there is. But the big question is what are you willing to pay to seek remedy. And the next question is will you win?
Being a poker player you know that odds play into every hand. So what are the odds and the return on your investment to persue this matter legally. I would say not too good.
My advice to you is take what they are offering, contact their support stating what you feel is a positive settlement, wait for their stupid reply... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: bubbasbestbabe at October 15, 2006, 1:55 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
OMB, they are offering you $1800. You feel you are entitled to more. If this is the case then more than likely you will find a lawyer who will be willing to take your case. But take in considereation, how much more money are you talking about for yourself? You say $10,000. Okay fair enough. Now let's look at the big picture here.
From how you are posting I will say that you are from a country that is not home to party poker. You want to know if there is legal recourse for your situation. Of course there is. But the big question is what are you willing to pay to seek remedy. And the next question is will you win?
Being a poker player you know that odds play into every hand. So what are the odds and the return on your investment to persue this matter legally. I would say not too good.
My advice to you is take what they are offering, contact their support stating what you feel is a positive settlement, wait for their stupid reply and delete the site. If you wish to continue going after t... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 15, 2006, 1:00 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by shinedown.45
IMO, you have no legal right to any money won at an on-line casino,
I believe the only money your entitled to is the amount you used for the entry into the satellite + whatever your deposit was, and if you are getting anymore than that, be grateful.
As the old saying goes: Don't look a gift horse in the mouth or as I like to put it, Don't kick a gift horse in the teeth....lol
So I have no legal right to money collected under false pretenses? Party can say, join this table, extra rake will go to a tournament, and then keep that when things dont work out when it was obvious there was a risk of that?
I just wish all of you had worked hard to get a pass into the Final and could get some real perspective on this, instead of telling me I should be glad that Party ripped me off.
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| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 15, 2006, 12:56 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by wsorbust
Perhaps you should consult a LEGAL forum or other more appropriate sources when asking such questions. This is clearly a Poker forum, thus you will receive no worthy advice unless someone here happens to have acquired their law degree or cunsulted a law firm already with a similar matter. If I were you, I would suggest consulting from a professional.
Im sorry, I thought this is a Poker forum? Where many people would be aware of legal or other options I can take. I was actually given a few good pieces of advice from some people here, the best of which was to contact the gaming commission that is over sites like Party.
So this clearly was a good place to post a question, and thus I did receive some worthy advice from people who don't have a law degree.
The post states what legal (course, should be recourse, or options) do I have, but in reality I should have just said, what options... leaving options available beyond the leg... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 15, 2006, 12:52 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by robwhufc
Didn't they add $5 Million of their own money to the Monster Freeroll? Do you expect a slice of that back too? Maybe you should reject the $1,800 and ask for your buy-in back instead?
They added that money to get people to play at their site, it worked... now they have the right to take that back?
Even without that, they are still holding back a significant amount of money put in their by people playing at their site.
I love how all of you are defending Party, normally people can't rip on Party enough, but when they do something this outlandish you think it is fair because the States passed a law, so its not Party's fault?
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| Posted by: shinedown.45 at October 15, 2006, 10:40 am | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
IMO, you have no legal right to any money won at an on-line casino,
I believe the only money your entitled to is the amount you used for the entry into the satellite + whatever your deposit was, and if you are getting anymore than that, be grateful.
As the old saying goes: Don't look a gift horse in the mouth or as I like to put it, Don't kick a gift horse in the teeth....lol
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| Posted by: wsorbust at October 15, 2006, 10:14 am | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote:
Thank you VERY much for your detailed and in depth explanation. I'm glad you are an expert on these matters and can answer with a single sentence, but for those of us who DONT already know the answer, would you care to elaborate?
Perhaps you should consult a LEGAL forum or other more appropriate sources when asking such questions. This is clearly a Poker forum, thus you will receive no worthy advice unless someone here happens to have acquired their law degree or cunsulted a law firm already with a similar matter. If I were you, I would suggest consulting from a professional.
Party and other companies have lost millions in recent days. I don't konw what anyone was playing there to begin with, but I doubt they could care less if you sue them because they're not based in the U.S., and if you are, the U.S. government wouldn't allow and waste their time with such a lawsuit under new law...that's just my opinion.
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| Posted by: robwhufc at October 15, 2006, 6:04 am | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by OneMoreBust
1) They dont have to give me anything?
2) My government made the law that screwed all this up, what would your argument be to the English, German, Swedish people who also only got $1800
3) How does holding back 3/4 or 1/2 the prize pool make them "admirable"?
4) I can direct fury at my government, but Party Poker gambled. They made a bet that things wouldn't change on this side of the pond until after the monster, and they lost that bet... That doesn't give them the right to take half the money and run.....
Didn't they add $5 Million of their own money to the Monster Freeroll? Do you expect a slice of that back too? Maybe you should reject the $1,800 and ask for your buy-in back instead?
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| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 14, 2006, 8:11 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by robwhufc
They are giving him $1,800 when they dont have to give him anything and the law was changed by HIS government making it illegal for him to play online poker. OneMoreBust, i'd be pissed as well if i was you but Party Poker have behaved admirably by giving you a cash amount for your entry (if that is in fact what they have done) - Titan didn't do this for Threesixes. You should be directing your fury at your government not Party Poker.
1) They dont have to give me anything?
2) My government made the law that screwed all this up, what would your argument be to the English, German, Swedish people who also only got $1800
3) How does holding back 3/4 or 1/2 the prize pool make them "admirable"?
4) I can direct fury at my government, but Party Poker gambled. They made a bet that things wouldn't change on this side of the pond until after the monster, and they lost that bet... That doesn't give them the right to take half the ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: smd173 at October 14, 2006, 7:56 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Maybe they are using the extra money to try and cover their overlays for the Party Poker Million on Sunday's which hasn't been hitting a Million since PokerStars was running the WCOOP.
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| Posted by: Dorkus Malorkus at October 14, 2006, 4:46 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
They've 'behaved admirably' by essentially holding back $5-15 million (the estimates ary) in funds primarily contributed by players paying extra rake in the belief that Party would see this promo through?
Umm, okay. If I go to rob a bank and get $1 million handed over to me, am I 'behaving admirably' by only taking $500k and leaving the rest?
Party are idiots (the whole Monster promo was stupid anyway, their support sucks, etc etc) and the sooner they crash and burn the better.
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| Posted by: robwhufc at October 14, 2006, 4:29 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
They are giving him $1,800 when they dont have to give him anything and the law was changed by HIS government making it illegal for him to play online poker. OneMoreBust, i'd be pissed as well if i was you but Party Poker have behaved admirably by giving you a cash amount for your entry (if that is in fact what they have done) - Titan didn't do this for Threesixes. You should be directing your fury at your government not Party Poker.
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| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 14, 2006, 4:26 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by Four Dogs
You may or may not have any legal recourse, but Party Poker, as are all of the reputable gaming sites, is in some way answerable to its licencing authority; in the case of Party, that would be the Government of Gibralter. You may lodge your grievance here. A single e-mail from one dissatisfied customer might not get much attention. It may help if you can marshal up the participation others effected by this apparent dereliction of trust.
Thank you for this information, ery helpful!
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| Posted by: Four Dogs at October 14, 2006, 4:17 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
You may or may not have any legal recourse, but Party Poker, as are all of the reputable gaming sites, is in some way answerable to its licencing authority; in the case of Party, that would be the Government of Gibralter. You may lodge your grievance here. A single e-mail from one dissatisfied customer might not get much attention. It may help if you can marshal up the participation others effected by this apparent dereliction of trust.
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| Posted by: Egon Towst at October 14, 2006, 3:30 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by OneMoreBust
Just to be clear, if I go to a casino, and win 200,000 in chips, according to "Gambling debts aren't recoverable by law" they can just tell me to f off ?
Again, I`m not a lawyer, but yes, I believe so.
However, in the UK at least, you do have an appeal route. Casinos here are regulated by the Gambling Commission, and you can complain to them if you feel aggrieved. The Commission have ery extensive powers and can fine operators for irregular conduct, or even revoke their license and close them down.
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| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 14, 2006, 3:11 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by Egon Towst
Maybe this might help. In Party`s terms and conditions of use, which you have to agree to when you open your account, it says:
"The Company reserves the right to suspend, modify, remove and/or add any Game in its sole discretion with immediate effect and without notice and the Company will not be liable for any such action."
I figured as much...
I guess the amounts they are paying out is just to save face.... as paying out 1/4 of the money and keeping 3/4 of the money is still rather profitable
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| Posted by: Egon Towst at October 14, 2006, 3:05 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Maybe this might help. In Party`s terms and conditions of use, which you have to agree to when you open your account, it says:
"The Company reserves the right to suspend, modify, remove and/or add any Game in its sole discretion with immediate effect and without notice and the Company will not be liable for any such action."
Edit: Another thought. In general terms, Rob would be right that gambling takes place outside the law. However, as I understand it (and I`m not a lawyer, so don`t necessarily take me as an authority) it is arguable under UK law that poker is not gambling, since it is a game of skill. I believe that there is a case under way currently around this issue, not yet resolved, last I heard.
Also, Party is registered on the UK Stock Exchange and licensed in the British Overseas Territory of Gibraltar - therefore bound by UK law. That being the case, I suggest your contract with them would be enforceable in a UK court. Sadly, because the section I have qu... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 14, 2006, 3:05 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Just to be clear, if I go to a casino, and win 200,000 in chips, according to "Gambling debts aren't recoverable by law" they can just tell me to f off ?
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| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 14, 2006, 3:03 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by robwhufc
Gambling debts aren't recoverable by law - that succinct enough for you?
I guess that helps a little more than "none, sorry".
I will continue my research from there, thank you.
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| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 14, 2006, 2:55 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Quote: Originally Posted by robwhufc
None, sorry
Thank you VERY much for your detailed and in depth explanation. I'm glad you are an expert on these matters and can answer with a single sentence, but for those of us who DONT already know the answer, would you care to elaborate?
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| Posted by: OneMoreBust at October 14, 2006, 2:39 pm | | Topic: What legal course do I have? Forum: Card Chat |
Party poker has cancelled its Monster tournament structure.
The structure is
100k Weekly Tournament, 25% make it into the Monthly 8000 people
$1 million Monthly Tournament, 12.5% make it into the Final 8000 people
Final tournament, current prize pool $14 million 8000 people
Cut from their site
Cash alues for each freeroll (not taking into account any future alue):
Grand final: ( $14,405,786 Prize Pool / 8,000 players ) = $1,800.72 per player
Monthly: ( $1,000,000 Prize Pool / 8,000 players ) = $125.00 per player
Weekly: ( $100,000 Prize Pool / 8,000 players ) = $12.50 per player
Probability of advancing from one tournament to another:
Weekly to Monthly = ( 2,000 players advancing / 8,000 players advancing ) = 1 out of 4
Monthly to Grand Final = ( 1,000 players advancing / 8,000 players advancing ) = 1 out of 8
Future alues for each freeroll:Value of a Monthly freeroll to a player w... | | Read Entire Entry |
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