| Posted by: 1819 at August 28, 2006, 5:46 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
[quote=sweetdenny;118886]
The fact that beenhad lost to him heads up and knew about it does not have any bearing (unless beenhad is linked to said fraudster ) on whether the poker room recovers the money from him or not.
the fact that he did know links him. how could it not?
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| Posted by: sweetdenny at August 28, 2006, 5:24 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
The point about beenhad taking the fraudster to court is surely wrong would he not have to firstly take paradise to court first to decide whether they were within their rights to confiscate his funds.
At the moment he only has an email stating that the funds were fraudulent this would firstly have to be proven in court to be the case before he could attempt to recover the funds from the third person.
If the fraudster did use a stolen card which seems likely then the poker room should take this loss not a player if they allow fradulent players to enter the site then they have to tighten things up.
As has been mentioned if this fraudster had played on the site and lost normally then the poker room would not have confiscated the money from players who won it from him.
The fact that beenhad lost to him heads up and knew about it does not have any bearing (unless beenhad is linked to said fraudster ) on whether the poker room recovers the money from him or not. | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Casinomeister at August 22, 2006, 9:11 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
To all those whose IQs seems to be linked to their shoe size...I'm not saying I was raped, I'm comparing your responses to the "you deserved it!" blithering idiocy of people who blame ictims for their situation.
Honestly silcngayc...continously screaming "you did it!!! you're guilty!!! the blood is on your hands!!!111!!" won't make it so. You obviously have knowingly been complicit in conning somone and are guilt-ridden or have no ability to consider alternatives with your black or white thinking. I'm surprised you weren't the one to come up with the glib "you can't con an honest man" garbage.
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
silcngayc- yet again you have not added anything of any substance to this thread except your usual petty idiocy. Not to mention that you have done so in a jumbled, incomprehensible, grammatical-nightmare of a way.
1.1 - No "Flaming": P... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Beenhad at August 22, 2006, 7:05 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
silcngayc- yet again you have not added anything of any substance to this thread except your usual petty idiocy. Not to mention that you have done so in a jumbled, incomprehensible, grammatical-nightmare of a way.
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| Posted by: silcnlayc at August 21, 2006, 2:38 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Ok, here goes. My suggestion is to leave well (or bad as may be) alone and bite the bullet and put it in the "learned lesson" pile for why would you even consider exposing yourself to more of this
Quote:
Perhaps it is my own fault and did not make it clear, but I was simply asking for help/suggestions and not the lambasting that 98% of this post turned out to be.
lambasting as you call it or ridicule for doing something you were well aware of and that is put in WRITING that is against the rules ( collusion).
Do you not know if just the few of us believe you to be just as guilty as the one that stole the money, others in the "real" world will too? I suggest you not try to do anything about this except to remembr it for what good will embarrassing yourself in front of bank officials do except make them know what it was you were doing? As I said, if you don't have clean hands going into court, you lose automatically. Thats just the law. Just trying t... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: winbig at August 21, 2006, 8:13 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Hopefully that person is in the USA. Thanks to the patriot act, everyone that opens a bank account has to provide a state issued ID or passport, etc...as well as a alid social security number.
Even if it's a different person's account, they can still be charged as an accessory.
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| Posted by: pokeraddict at August 21, 2006, 7:48 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
You are going to go to the bank and tell them someone this scam and think they are going to not only reimburse you but pursue the other guy too? Did you bank wire this money or send a Western Union or did he get it some other way?
Here is some constructive thought assuming Paradise does not owe you any more then the $1000 they confiscated.
Figure out if this name is legit that you sent it to. If so go after them legally (provided they are in the same country as you). I have a feeling the identity of the other party is not the person you sent it to though.
You cannot reverse a bank wire. That is the whole point of a bank wire and why the other person involved wanted a bank wire (or Western Union if that is how you sent it). This way the other party can immediately take the payout in cash and never worry about it again.
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| Posted by: Beenhad at August 21, 2006, 6:25 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Thank you winbig for your well thought-out post. The only part I'd have to disagree with is the asking for feedback portion. Perhaps it is my own fault and did not make it clear, but I was simply asking for help/suggestions and not the lambasting that 98% of this post turned out to be.
I'm done trying to reason with the others who are deadset on labeling me the illain in all this.
P.S. thanks for the bank suggestion, I'll have to try it tomorrow and hope for the best.
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| Posted by: pokeraddict at August 21, 2006, 5:18 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
I'm comparing your responses to the "you deserved it!" blithering idiocy of people who blame ictims for their situation.
I do not think anyone has blamed the guy that had $1000 stolen from him by the fraudster you teamed up with. I think it is widely agreed he is the only true ictim. Agreeing to participate in a chip dump and cashier bypass for another player for a fee does not quite fit the ictim profile in my eyes.
As far as trying to hunt the guy down, stop wasting your time. You're out money from a poor choice. Don't you already know this guys identity anyway? Didn't you wire him money?
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| Posted by: silcnlayc at August 21, 2006, 2:10 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote:
I write to them asking "what happened" and they wrote me back saying that I had provided the incorrect address that did not match up with my Neteller account; this much is true, however I only provided the wrong address
Quote:
How could this go wrong?"
Sure enough he purposely loses $1000 to me raising big, making folds to a reraise and by letting me know what cards he had.
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nafanny29 :Collusion is another reason why you will get your account locked an funds seized by the site.
Enough said.
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| Posted by: nafanny29 at August 21, 2006, 1:07 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by 1819
lol. my i.q. might equal my shoesize but im smart enough not to fall for such a simple scam. you do deserve it. dont try to say you were just trying to help someone out out of the kindness of your heart. if you want to help someone olunteer at a soup kitchen.
Very well said.
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| Posted by: 1819 at August 21, 2006, 12:38 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
To all those whose IQs seems to be linked to their shoe size...I'm not saying I was raped, I'm comparing your responses to the "you deserved it!" blithering idiocy of people who blame ictims for their situation.
Honestly silcngayc...continously screaming "you did it!!! you're guilty!!! the blood is on your hands!!!111!!" won't make it so. You obviously have knowingly been complicit in conning somone and are guilt-ridden or have no ability to consider alternatives with your black or white thinking. I'm surprised you weren't the one to come up with the glib "you can't con an honest man" garbage.
lol. my i.q. might equal my shoesize but im smart enough not to fall for such a simple scam. you do deserve it. dont try to say you were just trying to help someone out out of the kindness of your heart. if you want to help someone olunteer at a soup kitchen.
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| Posted by: winbig at August 20, 2006, 11:25 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
To all those whose IQs seems to be linked to their shoe size...
This is a public forum. You're asking for feedback, and you're getting it. Insulting others just because they are stating their opinions is bs.
Quote:
I'm not saying I was raped, I'm comparing your responses to the "you deserved it!" blithering idiocy of people who blame ictims for their situation.
Nobody's blaming you. I'm sure we've all been the ictim of a con to some degree at least once in our life. I speak for myself, but I'm sure you could have thought of a better comparison than someone being raped.
Quote:
Honestly silcngayc...continously screaming "you did it!!! you're guilty!!! the blood is on your hands!!!111!!" won't make it so. You obviously have knowingly been complicit in conning somone and are guilt-ridden or have no ability to consider alternatives with your black or white thinking. ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Beenhad at August 20, 2006, 11:07 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by 1819
comparing trying to make a quick buck and being raped is insane. you have no recourse. you tryed to get over and got burned. blame is on you. learn your lesson and move on. dont pretend thet your were just trying to help someone out. please...
To all those whose IQs seems to be linked to their shoe size...I'm not saying I was raped, I'm comparing your responses to the "you deserved it!" blithering idiocy of people who blame ictims for their situation.
Honestly silcngayc...continously screaming "you did it!!! you're guilty!!! the blood is on your hands!!!111!!" won't make it so. You obviously have knowingly been complicit in conning somone and are guilt-ridden or have no ability to consider alternatives with your black or white thinking. I'm surprised you weren't the one to come up with the glib "you can't con an honest man" garbage.
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| Posted by: silcnlayc at August 20, 2006, 9:59 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote:
what route do you think I should take? Private investigator? Lawyer? Any insight into who would be helpful in tracking down this low-life or any organizations that would be willing to lend a helping hand?
If you know the anything about the law, then you know you are out of luck because you can't go after someone if your hands aren't clean and by taking this money and knowingly breaking the poker rooms own rules, your case (if you even get that far with an attorney who will happily take your money up front and will tell you after you pay the fee) will be thrown out due to your hands being just as dirty.
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| Posted by: dominique at August 20, 2006, 4:36 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
Already refuted once and inylweatherman's post seems to agree.
The base of all these cons is greed. Greed to the extent of over riding common sense and decency.
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| Posted by: winbig at August 20, 2006, 4:08 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
Anyhow inylweatherman (or anyone else who actually decides to be of any use) what route do you think I should take? Private investigator? Lawyer? Any insight into who would be helpful in tracking down this low-life or any organizations that would be willing to lend a helping hand?
If you wanted to take it to that extent, I'm sure you could file charges with the court, then ask for all records pertaining to this person from Paradise. They would have no choice but to comply with a court order.
Why bother though? I could guarantee it's going to cost more than the $600 you're out to pursue this....and even then you're not guaranteed to win.
...And that's assuming he actually gave Paradise his real information when signing up; which I'm sure he didn't. Sure, you can get the IP addresses he's used to login to Paradise, but then you're going to need another court order to give the ISP so they can release the information as to who i... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: 1819 at August 20, 2006, 3:42 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
A big thanks to Vinylweatherman who finally provided a useful and insightful post .
Meanwhile, back in hindsight-is-20/20-ville:
Yup, you knew exactly what I was thinking and I knew exactly how he received the ill-gotten funds. Short end of the stick where I belong? WTF is that?! "That girl deserved to be raped! With what she was wearing she was asking for it!" Yeesh...
Already refuted once and inylweatherman's post seems to agree.
Anyhow inylweatherman (or anyone else who actually decides to be of any use) what route do you think I should take? Private investigator? Lawyer? Any insight into who would be helpful in tracking down this low-life or any organizations that would be willing to lend a helping hand?
comparing trying to make a quick buck and being raped is insane. you have no recourse. you tryed to get over and got burned. blame is on you. learn your lesson a... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Beenhad at August 20, 2006, 9:08 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
A big thanks to Vinylweatherman who finally provided a useful and insightful post .
Meanwhile, back in hindsight-is-20/20-ville:
Quote: Originally Posted by silcnlayc
YOU KNEW but yet you went ahead and did it...and YOU are now pissed cause YOU got caught on the short end of the stick, just where you belong...
Yup, you knew exactly what I was thinking and I knew exactly how he received the ill-gotten funds. Short end of the stick where I belong? WTF is that?! "That girl deserved to be raped! With what she was wearing she was asking for it!" Yeesh...
Quote:
A ery wise man once said "You cant con and honest man"
Yep. That's exactly right.
Already refuted once and inylweatherman's post seems to agree.
Anyhow inylweatherman (or anyone else who actually decides to be of any use) what route do you think I should take? Private investigator? Lawyer? Any insight into who would be helpful in tracking... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: silcnlayc at August 20, 2006, 1:26 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote:
It sounded quite suspect but I thought, "hey if he loses the money to me there is no way he can steal it back. How could this go wrong?"]
In your own words...you knew it was something odd.....and yet you sit there and say your innocent??
Quote:
Well SORRY for unknowingly f***ing being complicit with some low-life internet criminal.
Be real...YOU KNEW but yet you went ahead and did it...and YOU are now pissed cause YOU got caught on the short end of the stick, just where you belong...
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| Posted by: vinylweatherman at August 19, 2006, 11:14 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
This is just the internet ersion of the so called "Nigerian fraud". This is where an ex member of the Nigerian government (or any other country undergoing political turmoil) will approach people in order to help the move a sum of money out of the country. They will have a suitable "victim" story to convince you it is they who have been wronged, and will offer you a cut in order to use your bank accounts to move the money.
A similar one, which is probably closer to how this one worked, is to pay for something with a company check, but claim that your "stupid secretary" made it out for too large an amount, and it is too inconvenient to get it changed in time to complete the deal, and ask that you accept the check and pay back the difference, keeping an amount for yourself for your troubles.
This has been known on eBay, who tightened up, only for ictims to be hit by a fraud that used the new tighter eBay rules to rip off ictims by the fraudsters themselves pretending... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Beenhad at August 18, 2006, 1:15 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by nafanny29
A ery wise man once said "You cant con and honest man"
Specious at best but nowhere near wise.
Good, honest people are the biggest targets of con artists if only for the reason that they want to help and are ery trusting.
Meanwhile, you guys are projecting your anger towards the scumbag who stole the credit card, hacked a person's account, or whatever he did to steal $1000, onto me. Well SORRY for unknowingly f***ing being complicit with some low-life internet criminal.
Christ...
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| Posted by: pokeraddict at August 18, 2006, 12:30 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
I fail to see the security flaw you describe. A player chip dumped money he stole most likely from a stolen CC or Neteller account. He then dump it off. This drew a red flag sent to their security where they investigated and caught someone chip dumping fraudulantly obtained funds by reviewing the hands and the chat. If this player had lost this money to you fair and square then it is ery doubtful they would have taken the funds from you. Since you openly discussed chip dumping and openly discussed dealt cards it was obvious to them you were in on the scam. It was an easy and obvious choice to take the fraudulant funds from you. Why should they then reward you by letting you keep funds you obviously obtained iolating the T&C's on the site? It does not matter whether you intended to defraud them, you participated in a fraud.
From their site:
Quote:
Committing Fraud is an extremely serious offence, and if, in the Company's sole determination, you are found to have... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: NoMouthToScream at August 18, 2006, 12:15 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
If indeed paradise poker does have a security flaw that was compromised, this should have been the subject of the conversation, rather than you joined ranks with a person to gain $400 because "apparently" he had problems cashing out.
Let's say paradise had a security flaw, check if any others have experienced this particular problem, with funds being lost. Surely the person who lost the $1000 wasn't the only one. I want a secure poker site as much as the next person.
P.S. Would you have reported this security flaw if paradise didn't take your $1000?
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| Posted by: nafanny29 at August 18, 2006, 12:01 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
letting me know what cards he had.
Collusion is another reason why you will get your account locked an funds seized by the site.
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| Posted by: nafanny29 at August 17, 2006, 11:58 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
Great, so I got robbed and I'm the bad guy...
Look, I'm not a bad guy for being duped. Naive and too trusting? Yes, but bad, no.
I'am also glad the person who was originally duped in some fashion got their money back. Nonetheless, it is not my problem that Paradise Poker has a security flaw; they should be the ones who have to eat it for their inept security, not myself or the other ictim.
No sympathy from me either im afraid. The internet is full of scams and you only add petrol to the fire by your greed.
A ery wise man once said "You cant con and honest man"
Hopefully you have learnt from this loss and will be less trusting of strangers in the future.
And compared to the ast sums of money some folks lose to scams its a cheap lesson really.
And any pokersite that catches ANY player dumping chips will usually freeze both accounts (Usually for the exact reason that you... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Beenhad at August 17, 2006, 11:12 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Great, so I got robbed and I'm the bad guy...
Look, I'm not a bad guy for being duped. Naive and too trusting? Yes, but bad, no.
I'am also glad the person who was originally duped in some fashion got their money back. Nonetheless, it is not my problem that Paradise Poker has a security flaw; they should be the ones who have to eat it for their inept security, not myself or the other ictim.
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| Posted by: NoMouthToScream at August 17, 2006, 9:04 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
As someone slightly mentioned above, if the roles were reversed and you lost $1000, I bet you would want to get these funds back. The truth of the matter is, these scammers continue to thrive, because someone will eventually bite.
Moral of the story:
If it sounds too good to be true, it usually is.
How true.
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| Posted by: pokeraddict at August 17, 2006, 7:56 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
I think the scammer used a stolen credit card (or other stolen deposit method) or someone chip dumped to him that used one. They also may have colluded at another table. He knew he could not get the money out himself since the funds were fraudulant so he had find another way. NEVER allow someone to chip dump to you and NEVER fall for "I'll trade you $x at x Poker Room for $x at x processor". These almost always turn out to be scams where either the Paypal/Neteller money is fraudulant or the poker room money is. Then the poker room thinks you are a scammer too and as you found out close your account and seize your funds.
Fraud is a massive issue at online poker rooms just as I am sure it is for casinos and sportsbooks. Players open up fraudulant accounts and chip dump to their friends or pull this scam posted above to try and get the money out. Even if he had just transfered the money to you Paradise still would have confiscated the funds, they may not have closed your account though... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: silcnlayc at August 17, 2006, 2:19 pm | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
I posted about 2 months ago about my Neteller account being hijacked at Paradise poker and how Paradise refused to acknowledge that it was at thier site that someone was trying to remove funds from my account.
I guess now they are taking it more seriously that they just might have some kind of glitch in thier software where people can actually steal information of other players from this site, for this is where all the tries to withdraw large amount of funds originated in my Neteller account and I proved this to them and they still called me a liar, even with proof.
Go figure, must be happening a lot more it seems and they are finally taking notice. Shame on you Paradise!
And shame on you Beenhad for even thinking of going along with this kind of con job. If it happened to you where all your funds just dissapeared out of your account, would you be so complecent as you are now about doing what you did?
Quote:
It sounded quite suspect but I thought, "h... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: winbig at August 17, 2006, 10:42 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Beenhad
So if he had used the "transfer money" option it would have been okay? Losing purposefully is bad because it's purposeful even when it affects no other players?
In a sense, yes, it may have gotten by them if he just simply transferred the money to your account.
Quote:
People should still know how it is this guy defrauded the website or another person so as to avoid this scam themselves in the future.
True, but if they published this information, there would be more people trying to run the scam...if not at paradise, then elsewhere. Not everyone would read that information about the scam. For instance, it's all over the web NOT to give any password out to strangers, but yet you hear about people giving out their passwords all the time.
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| Posted by: Beenhad at August 17, 2006, 10:34 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
So if he had used the "transfer money" option it would have been okay? Losing purposefully is still bad even when it affects no other players?
People should still know how it is this guy defrauded the website or another person so as to avoid this scam themselves in the future.
Edit: grammar
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| Posted by: winbig at August 17, 2006, 9:58 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
Moral of the story:
If it sounds too good to be true, it usually is.
You have no recourse here. What you guys did is against the terms of ANY poker room; online or off. At most, they need to return any balance left in your account *before* you sat down and played with this person.
[edit]But then again, you tried to defraud them...in their eyes, how do they know you won any previous money fair and square?
It really doesn't matter where he got the money, so they really have no reason to give that information out...
[edit]The reason it doesn't matter where he got the money is because you broke their terms...plain and simple.
Last edit: You know chats are monitored, right? I wouldn't doubt it if someone from Paradise was there watching you the whole time.
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| Posted by: Beenhad at August 17, 2006, 9:21 am | | Topic: I was unaware of this scam Forum: Casino Meister |
I was playing my usual rounds of poker when someone known as "playa73" started chatting me up. After a short chat he told me he wanted to lose $1000 to me. When asked why, he claimed he needed the money in a hurry and cashing out takes longer, than the timeframe he was on, allowed.
So he said he'd lose the money to me and I'd send him $600 and I could keep the $400 as a "thank you" for doing him this favor.
It sounded quite suspect but I thought, "hey if he loses the money to me there is no way he can steal it back. How could this go wrong?"
Sure enough he purposely loses $1000 to me raising big, making folds to a reraise and by letting me know what cards he had. Once I have the $1000 into my account I think, "wow, this guy is serious...". (As a side note: this was on Paradise's 1v1 tables and I in no way affected other players)
So I wire him the money and the next day I can't log into Paradise Poker. I write to them asking "wh... | | Read Entire Entry |
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