| Posted by: wolfman at December 11, 2006, 4:44 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
We read that in another thread a couple of days ago. What are you trying to achieve by copying an old post into multiple threads? A ery poor and ill-thought out response to all the questions that have been asked since you posted it the first time.
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| Posted by: VegasVIP Lounge at December 11, 2006, 12:43 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
The Minivegas Group of which the Vegas Joker and Vegas Country Casinos are members, has issued the following statement:
The Minivegas Group would like to express its sincerest regret over a recent dispute that has arisen between the Casino Group and a number of players that are known to have been partaking in what can only be described as exploitative and abusive playing activities.
Following an in-depth investigation of this case, the Minivegas Group initially took the decision to lock the offending player's accounts and refund their initial deposits.
Although the Minivegas Group knows that this was the correct and just response to the actions of the players in question, criticism from the wider gaming community has prompted it to reappraise its recent actions. In turn the Minivegas Group has decided to pay the offending players their winnings. The Minivegas Group would like to emphasise that the circumstances relating to this case are quite different from any other that it ha... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: eeeee at December 8, 2006, 10:37 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Reasonable casino behavior -
Accept $, Accept Bets, Ban, Pay, then Change the deal after learning lessons
Questionable casino behavior -
Accept $, Accept Bets, Delay payment through ruses and bans and redirects and document requests, Obscure and misinterpret the deal, finally Pay
Unreasonable casino behavior -
Accept $, Accept Bets, Ban, then Ignore and keep all funds
There are many other casinos that follow the Reasonable path. You don't hear about them here.
Questionable behavior is typically dealt to an advantage player about 20% of the time. Not OK, but to be expected now and then. No pleasure play for you!
I've played a ton of places, and avoided Unreasonable casinos/poker rooms all but twice. There's no excuse for it.
I'm not sure I can imagine fraud, unless it has to do with misrepresented ID with bonuses or code hacking. Please elaborate if I'm wrong. 'Fraud' label cannot fairly be applied to lucky winne... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: sorry4me at December 8, 2006, 9:42 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
I believe that this group was indeed hit by some fraudulent players this past summer as has been mentioned in arious threads. I also believe this casino group is now trying correct a recent mistake. My greatest criticism concerned their non-responsive behavior. This is probably a form letter that was sent to all the accounts that were locked and then reopened. Anyways, I'm satisfied now that I have received a response and that I have been paid the money that I won while playing at their casino. As for my play, I would like to say that I am the first one in history to devise some grand betting system that can beat a casino game, however that would be ridiculous. Anyways, this group appears to be paying their players now and that's a good thing. Hopefully, they will continue to reform their image since it is ery upsetting to see Microgamining mentioned on the Rogued list.
Edit: To specifically answer some of the questions raised while I was typing my original response, which is more likely, a cas... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: soflat at December 8, 2006, 9:29 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by inylweatherman
Please tell,
We are all puzzled by this. In a reply to the forum we have been told this was not Fraud, nor was it a scam, and it was not even bonus abuse!
The only clue was that it was a winning slots system, one which has now been elevated from the status of "snake oil", to one of potential interest by the admission by word and action from the casino, that it actually WORKS!
Yeah, and if there is a secret you don't have to give up the whole thing.
It is something so incredible that the casino cannot mention it and they have never seen before
But it wasn't cheating, or any of the usual culprits.
Was it a system?
A syndicate?
Or what?
Why were you guys all playing the same game? Or were you?
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| Posted by: vinylweatherman at December 8, 2006, 9:19 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Please tell,
We are all puzzled by this. In a reply to the forum we have been told this was not Fraud, nor was it a scam, and it was not even bonus abuse!
The only clue was that it was a winning slots system, one which has now been elevated from the status of "snake oil", to one of potential interest by the admission by word and action from the casino, that it actually WORKS!
One player at least suggests that a bonus is not required!
The only LEGAL slot systems of that nature are all based on the games having a non-random element to them that can be exploited by the knowledgeable player. This is not something I have been lead to believe is a factor in games from reputable software companies such as Microgaming.
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| Posted by: sorry4me at December 8, 2006, 8:57 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Finally ... a respose from the casino!
Quote:
Dear Sorry4me,
Casino account: clrxxxxxxxx
Colosseum Casino would like to express its sincerest regret over the recent dispute that has arisen between our Casino Group and you.
Following an in-depth investigation of your case, Colosseum Casino discovered that you were partaking in what can only be described as exploitative and abusive playing activities. Whilst the Management initially took the decision to lock your casino account and refund your initial deposits, criticism from the wider gaming community has prompted Colosseum Casino to reappraise its recent actions.
In turn Colosseum Casino has decided to unlock your account and has now paid you your outstanding "winnings". Please note that Colosseum Casino reserves the right to take whatever actions it sees as necessary should you be identified as displaying any further signs of engaging in exploitative playing activities.
... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: sorry4me at December 7, 2006, 11:46 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Wow .. they just paid me! I still have no clue what happened. I give them credit for doing the right thing, however I still wish they had communicated better. Still ... I received my money so I am happy. Thanks!
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| Posted by: sorry4me at December 6, 2006, 3:57 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Well ... I guess I'm going to accept that I'm not going to get paid by Coliseum Casino. I would pursue this some more but it doesn't look like anyone else (besides Red) is having any luck with this group of casinos and they won't even respond to me. This is my first experience with actual non payment (I once was slow paid by Club Player ... but they eventually paid up & they answered my emails ... the quality of the replies were suspect but at least they were replies) I sort of feel powerless in this matter but I'm sure that these business practices will eventually reap there proper reward ... I hope!
Good luck to the other ictims at this forum!
PS As a US player, I really miss Intercasino and many of the other reputable casinos that I used to be allowed to play at. I guess it's all downhill from here! At least I have CM's webcasts to sooth me in my distress.
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| Posted by: Gaahl at December 3, 2006, 4:34 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Congratulations RedKaos! Im still struggling to get paid my winnings tho :\
Hope they can realize that it is unacceptable to withold winnings from people fortunate enough to finaly win at a casino.. First you have to worry about winning, then you have to worry about beeing paid. That isnt they way it should be. (You should only have to worry about winning, and that is hard enough )
Btw. Did you have any email contact with them after you put the complaint out on this forum? What made them change their minds and pay you?
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| Posted by: rabiddog at December 1, 2006, 4:51 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
CM, PAB has been sent as per your suggestion.
Thanks
Edit: Woops, sorry CM. It looks like I sent duplicate PAB's. I thought that was the preview of the PAB and hit my back button to add Vegas Affiliates to the name of the casino and then resent it. My mistake.
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| Posted by: sorry4me at December 1, 2006, 1:04 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
I just received a refund of my initial deposit today in my neteller acount. I still haven't received a reply to my inquiry as to why my account is locked. Funny thing is they also sent me a promo email today! I'm confused! I'm happy to get my original deposit back but I would sort of like my winnings as well. However, I would at least like a response from the casino.
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| Posted by: rabiddog at November 30, 2006, 11:46 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
CM, sorry, I stopped reading the PAB when I saw the 500 euro's. I'll go back and look it over and probably will be filing. But let me ask first. Since VegasVIP Lounge is looking into this already, and he's the casino group rep on this board, what more can you do that he can't?
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| Posted by: terrellk11 at November 30, 2006, 10:25 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
FYI - I did submit a PAB yesterday.
I can understand how people can commit fraud by messing with deposits and withdrawals (cancelling payments and such); I can see how people can commit fraud in games where collusion is possible (poker players cheating using IM to collude with each other); I can see people abusing bonuses in ways that casinos might consider to be a fraudulent manner (though calling this fraud is a bit much if the player follows the casinos T&C).
I don't see how I can commit fraud playing slot machines. I also can't understand why if they think I committed fraud they are still sending me emails trying to get me to deposit and play games at their sites. Seems a bit contradicotry to me.
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| Posted by: tim5ny at November 30, 2006, 10:17 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Was a time not ery long ago when you could play most any Microgaming casino with confidence knowing you'd be paid. Guess those days are over. These casinos are having to operate at a much lower profit margin than they had been accustomed to when the U.S. players were filling their pockets with green. They don't want to give any of it back anymore, so I predict you'll be seeing alot more of these stalling tactics and player investigations from now on by certain groups that were formerely thought of as good casinos.
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| Posted by: Casinomeister at November 30, 2006, 10:12 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by rabiddog
For 500 euro's its not worth it for me to Pitch a Bitch. That's three times what Old Samurai owes me. I'm good with just the complaint in the message board for everyone to see who may be thinking about playing at the Vegas Affiliates group. As well as all the other message boards I will be posting at if my winnings are not paid out. Also why is it so easy for a casino to just use the word fraud to steal your money. How is fraud even committed. You go to the casino and play their games the way they are set up. Don't all casino's have the house advantage in their favor on every game. Some games just have a higher house advantage than others, so you would expect to win more on the higher HA games, wouldnt you? So what if some people get lucky and win some money, it's going to happen. The casino just pouts because a few people won some money so they say fraud was suspected, so we're keeping your money. Do they do this same stuff on people who win big mone... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: spearmaster at November 30, 2006, 9:50 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by rabiddog
For 500 euro's its not worth it for me to Pitch a Bitch. That's three times what Old Samurai owes me. I'm good with just the complaint in the message board for everyone to see who may be thinking about playing at the Vegas Affiliates group. As well as all the other message boards I will be posting at if my winnings are not paid out. Also why is it so easy for a casino to just use the word fraud to steal your money. How is fraud even committed. You go to the casino and play their games the way they are set up. Don't all casino's have the house advantage in their favor on every game. Some games just have a higher house advantage than others, so you would expect to win more on the higher HA games, wouldnt you? So what if some people get lucky and win some money, it's going to happen. The casino just pouts because a few people won some money so they say fraud was suspected, so we're keeping your money. Do they do this same stuff on people who win big mone... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: rabiddog at November 30, 2006, 9:24 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Casinomeister
I suggest that any one who is posting their complaint here submit a PAB and I'll try to get to the bottom of this.
Please note, if you have committed fraud - they won't tell you how they busted you out. They might tell me, but they won't tell you.
This sounds similar to the Bellerock ordeal a few months ago. There were a couple of fraud rings getting locked out, but a couple of innocent bystanders got in the way. I hope the persons posting here are those type of "bystanders". If you are committing fraud and posting in this forum you'll be in deep shinola.
So please PAB - thanks!
For 500 euro's its not worth it for me to Pitch a Bitch. That's three times what Old Samurai owes me. I'm good with just the complaint in the message board for everyone to see who may be thinking about playing at the Vegas Affiliates group. As well as all the other message boards I will be posting at if my winnings are ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Casinomeister at November 30, 2006, 7:42 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
I suggest that any one who is posting their complaint here submit a PAB and I'll try to get to the bottom of this.
Please note, if you have committed fraud - they won't tell you how they busted you out. They might tell me, but they won't tell you.
This sounds similar to the Bellerock ordeal a few months ago. There were a couple of fraud rings getting locked out, but a couple of innocent bystanders got in the way. I hope the persons posting here are those type of "bystanders". If you are committing fraud and posting in this forum you'll be in deep shinola.
So please PAB - thanks!
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| Posted by: rabiddog at November 30, 2006, 7:15 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Im seriously thinking about posting on every message board I am a member of, warning everyone about this casino groups tatics. Im also starting to wonder if Microgaming approves of these casino's using their software and treating customers this way.
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| Posted by: Ferretktf at November 30, 2006, 7:15 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Sadly I need to add my name to the list of people who have been apparently stiffed by the Vegas Affiliates group of Casinos.
I too have been waiting for some time for some withdrawals, includign one of £563.80 from Vegas Joker on 01NOV and £464 from Vegas Country on 04NOV. There are other smaller amounts owing from other casino's in the group.
When the payment had not appeared in my Neteller account after a few days, I took a look around and found that it was quite common for these Casino's to take up to ten days to pay out.
When they still had not appeared by 10NOV I chased them up and received a response saying they could not pay me without Identification (nice of them to ask upfront I thought, wonder how long they would have waited if I had not have chased).
I duly sent in a Bank Statement, Utility Bill, Driving Licence and the front/back of my Credit Card and was ery pleased to get a e-mail a few days later saying "CONGRATULATIONS!!! YOU PAYOUT ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: RedKaos at November 30, 2006, 6:13 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Earlier today I have received 2 paiements from E-Processing (200€ & 100€) without any e-mail sent by the casinos incriminated.
It's TOTALLY INACCEPTABLE and it's too easy to refuse winnings and refund players. (See Ghaal topic about his 2K win at Thunderstruck)
Avoid these casinos at all costs!!!
I don't give up.
To be continued
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| Posted by: cyprean at November 30, 2006, 11:58 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Thanks for your posts guys. This thread made me look at my account at Old Samurai Casino as someone had problems there concerning a cash out. It seems that my account has also been locked, and I have never received my cash out! I thought I could just cash out & forget as the WD was just under 200 euros.
A note to everyone: check your accounts if you have played and cashed out recently. My original cash out was requested on 12th November. On November 15th I sent them an e-mail and asked why I havent received my cash out. TI guess I forgot to come up with the issue as they never even cared to reply me. I am not ery impressed with their service so far, and suggest to proceed with caution with these guys until the current issues are resolved.
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| Posted by: sorry4me at November 30, 2006, 1:23 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
I've been waiting on a withdrawal from Coliseum Casino since November 8th. I logged on several days ago to see what was taking so long and I got a message that my account was locked. This is the first casino in the egas affiliate casino group that I have ever played at and like another poster, I did not recieve a sign-up bonus. I've emailed them but they have not replied to my request for an explination. They only owe me $377 so I'm not sure why they would have a problem paying me! As for locking my account, I have no clue why they would do this! It seems like they could at least send me an email explaining what they are doing. Perhaps, they are having financial issues?
Lately, I've been a little down about all the casinos that have turned their back on their US customers. I felt lucky that I could still play at microgaming (thankfully I'm not in one of the 11 banned states). It really sucks that I can't get paid for some casual casino play and that a group that still allows some US play can'... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: rabiddog at November 29, 2006, 11:32 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Same thing just happened to me. Old Samurai I guess gave me back my $100 deposit and kept the $175 winnings I made. I have 2 other accounts with this group and have a total of $924 combined, $220 of that is deposit. I havent tried to cashout at those yet. But I would enture to guess they will probably do the same and just return my deposit and keep the $704 I made. Im pretty sure I never took the bonuses at any of these casinos in the Vegas Affiliate group, just played some slots, blackjack and bacarrat.
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| Posted by: terrellk11 at November 29, 2006, 11:07 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
This has now escalated from a problem to outright fraudulent behavior on the part of the casino. As detailed above in my earlier post, I had withdrawals pending at three Vegas Affiliate casinos totalling $1010, consisting of $360 in deposits plus $650 in profits that were won at slot machines.
After three weeks of having my complaints and emails completely ignored and being given no explanation as to why my funds were being withheld, I have just learned that my initial $360 in deposits has been refunded to my Neteller account and the $650 in profits have been withheld.
This is completely unacceptable!!! Vegas Affiliates has essentially decided to withhold all of the winnings I made at their casinos without providing any explanation as to why they feel they are entitled to withhold those funds. I've been playing online at arious poker sites and casinos for more nearly five years and while I've had to deal with sites that have changed their T&C or that have been VERRRRYYYY slow i... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: VegasVIP Lounge at November 29, 2006, 3:53 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Dear All,
I would like to apologise for my delays in getting back to all the persons who have contributed to and been affected by the issues raised in this thread.
I am still awaiting information from the casino group regarding the complaints detailed above. I hope to bring you some information ery soon. Again, I thank you all for your patience and understanding.
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| Posted by: RedKaos at November 28, 2006, 7:23 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Vegas Joker CS have sent me an hilarious e-mail yesterday.
Dear David,
Thank you for your recent communication.
Please note that following the investigation, all your purchases have
been refunded.
We apologise for any inconvenience caused.
Please feel free to contact our Help Desk should you require
further assistance.
Best Regards,
Alexis
Vegas Joker Casino
I've never received anything from them since the 8th and my account remains locked. Great CS
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| Posted by: kavaman at November 28, 2006, 6:20 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
to Redkaos. For some reason this account shows that you have 5 posts, but im sure your right because otherwise you wouldn't have 35 rep points. And to others: like i previously said no pun intended ..
Ok. Maybe these folks really have problems because they have risen the playtrough requirements to 20xd+b and basically slots are only that are allowed on their signup bonuses. And usually those "audits", dont mean anything good for the players. Actually i dont remember an MG casino group doing audits that were not having cashflow problems.
Maybe they should audit the money going in too, besides the money going out........
-kavaman
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| Posted by: rabiddog at November 28, 2006, 8:13 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Well I cant figure out how to edit a post, so I'll do it here. I was looking through my emails and sent emails. It wasnt Old Samurai that asked me for documents, my mistake there. They just said my account was under investigation and if anything changed they would let me know. I replied and asked if there was anything I could do to help resolve the situation, and they basically just said the same thing. Then when I checked my account on Monday was when I found it was locked.
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| Posted by: rabiddog at November 28, 2006, 6:20 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Well as I said in my post above, I dont remember taking a bonus here. Most of the microgaming casino's I have done, I left off the bonus. And if you had to actually claim the bonus, then I def left it off. Its been 3 weeks since I did my casino so I cant actually say 100% for sure that I didnt do a bonus. Not without being able to look at my account. But my spreadsheet doesnt show that I did the bonus.
As far as signing up today, I explained that also. I had an account, but mostly just lurk to check out casino's before I sign up at them. I also use CM's links for signing up as well as other sites. But my original account must have been associated with a yahoo address I no longer use, probably because of spam. So I wasnt able to find my information. I tried a couple different log ins that I thought might be it, but none of them worked. So the simplest solution was to just make a new account with my current email address. In doing this I also made sure the account was consistant with other acco... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: vinylweatherman at November 28, 2006, 4:08 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
This lot have had many complaints of late. They had a major fraud investigation a while back, but I simply cannot see the logic in locking accounts of players who have not claimed a bonus. One argument for not claiming bonuses is that it makes certain there will be no trouble with meeting bonus terms, or tripping up on exclusions. These complaints are from players who did not claim bonuses, played on slots, and cashed out as soon as they were ahead, even if this was quickly after depositing.
The casino then holds the cashin, uses a delaying tactic (does nothing until the player asks, and then claims to be waiting for documents [did they actually ASK for these, or just wait a week till the player complained]).
I see that two complainants joined and complained this month, but one joined earlier. While this may indicate possible fraud, it is up to the casino to prove it, and justify their position.
I have already uninstalled all three of the accounts I had due to this continuing barrag... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: terrellk11 at November 28, 2006, 1:53 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by kavaman
No pun intended, but it makes me wonder why all the complaint makers have a low number of posts 1-20 on the board.
-kavaman
I've been gambling and playing poker online for close to five years, during which time I've made hundreds of posts at 2+2 and B2B Heaven's forums (forii?). I haven't had to post about casino complaints here because in five years I haven't had much reason to complain. I understand that some casinos are more reputable than others and I understand that some casinos pay a little slower than others. But in five years I've never had a casino shut down my account and refuse to pay me my funds.
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| Posted by: rabiddog at November 28, 2006, 12:05 am | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by kavaman
No pun intended, but it makes me wonder why all the complaint makers have a low number of posts 1-20 on the board.
-kavaman
None taken. Ive lurked here for close to a year. Even had an account and posted a few times. But it has been awhile and I couldnt find my account information. So I just made a new account that was consistant with other message board accounts. That way I wont forget my info anymore. Im old, things come and go quickly
By the way, is there a post requirment before you can make a complaint against a casino that doesn't want to pay? I mean, that kinda goes in the same thinking as "well you haven't not been paid by enough casino's to make a complaint" doesn't it?
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| Posted by: RedKaos at November 27, 2006, 11:46 pm | | Topic: Vegas Joker and Vegas Country not paying!! Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by kavaman
No pun intended, but it makes me wonder why all the complaint makers have a low number of posts 1-20 on the board.
-kavaman
and I understand why you have 200 posts...
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