| Posted by: pokeraddict at January 31, 2008, 3:51 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by pokeraddict
I think CAP uses the prune function. Any thread w/o a post over a certain period of time (prob 30 days) is pruned. CAP was one of the sites I was talking about.
This post was made by an admin there in this thread:
http://www.casinoaffiliateprograms.c...ad.php?t=22637
Now they don't seem to care after AP finally admitted it. AP is still certified and pushed on their site and PAP.
For some reason that thread was locked with some serious misinformation in it.
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| Posted by: KellyBlend at January 31, 2008, 10:01 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Want to see some further UB sick stuff? Head over and read this thread at 2+2. The opening post is really all you need to know:
Are you kidding me UB?
Found an interesting quote of Phil Hellmuth in his book "Play Poker like the pros" page 339:
Quote:
"The next Step – UltimateBet.com
……..
Finding a steady source of income sounded pretty good to me, since I knew that I could potentially lose all my money on any given day. The swings can drive a person toward insanity! As the old pros say: "Poker is a tough way to make an easy living."
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| Posted by: lots0 at January 21, 2008, 11:49 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
The KGC ( Kahnawake Gaming Commission ) have have screwed themselves.
Their lack of enforcement of even the most basic rules and their excessive greed have marked them as untrustworthy in the gambling world.
Everyone was watching how the KGC handled the Absolute Poker cheating scandal and no one was happy with the outcome... (Except for Absolute Poker)
The KGC has proven by their actions they can not be trusted after giving Absolute Poker a free pass for cheating and helping Absolute Poker to cover up the cheating. (OK the KGC fined Absolute Poker $500K, but all they really did was move the money from one pocket to another, if they were being real they should have given the fine money to gamblersanonymous.org )
If the KGC would have handled the Absolute Poker issue with resolve, openness and honesty, they would likely have been allowed to advertise in the UK and the legal beagles would not be prosecuting their licensee's right now.
But the KGC's own actions h... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: GaryWatson at January 21, 2008, 6:10 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Snowman
I wonder what action the KGC would have taken against any operation other than AP or UB who use the reservation servers? Probably a lot more than a financial slap on the wrist.
I wonder if Kahnawake has any powers other than collect a $15,000 application fee and $10,000 annual license. They appear to do nothing other than hand out recomendations. Their ability to do so is in question.
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/montreal/st...alace1129.html
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| Posted by: Snowman at January 21, 2008, 8:25 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Once more it's the players who uncovered this.
It was determined and diligent individuals (some of whom are on this site) who did the detective work to expose the AP cheating scandal, what the hell are the AP and UB security departments doing? (Answer: not much), particularly considering they have direct access to the servers and raw data. It beggers belief that they couldn't spot something untoward going on.
I wonder what action the KGC would have taken against any operation other than AP or UB who use the reservation servers? Probably a lot more than a financial slap on the wrist.
I think enough really is enough this time.
If this were a Vegas casino under NGC federal juristiction the doors would now be locked until a FULL, open and transparent investigation were completed. From the owners, to the KGC, to the offices of AP and UB in Costa Rica, this whole thing stinks...again.
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| Posted by: Self Made at January 21, 2008, 7:15 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by trambopoline
If you read all of the evidence against him and truly know all the facts of the case, its quite clear this is NOT a false alarm.
Can you summarize the case for us? I haven't followed this case much, other than reading about the fake Hellmuth emails.
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| Posted by: winbig at January 20, 2008, 11:30 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by GaryWatson
Lol, nice barbecue. I hope they didnt mean they would share a meal at their members expense.
It must be selective pruning
http://www.casinoaffiliateprograms.c...tes.0157.html?
Looking at 32Red, they dont have any threads deleted. It seems to only be AP who chose this option
Pretty interesting....I think 2005 is over the 30 day mark...which kills the idea that they auto-prune.
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| Posted by: GaryWatson at January 20, 2008, 11:15 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Lol, nice barbecue. I hope they didnt mean they would share a meal at their members expense.
It must be selective pruning
http://www.casinoaffiliateprograms.c...tes.0157.html?
Looking at 32Red, they dont have any threads deleted. It seems to only be AP who chose this option
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| Posted by: pokeraddict at January 20, 2008, 11:05 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
I think CAP uses the prune function. Any thread w/o a post over a certain period of time (prob 30 days) is pruned. CAP was one of the sites I was talking about.
This post was made by an admin there in this thread:
http://www.casinoaffiliateprograms.c...ad.php?t=22637
Quote: Originally Posted by Professor
Trust me if its proven that they allowed a past or present employee to rig games or tournaments we WILL BARBECUE THEIR ASS.
The last thing our industry needs is a scandal like this to make players uncomfortable about playing. We are taking this VERY seriously.
Now they don't seem to care after AP finally admitted it. AP is still certified and pushed on their site and PAP.
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| Posted by: GaryWatson at January 20, 2008, 10:57 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
I notice at CAP 121 of the last 127 Absolute Poker threads have been deleted. It is quite common for affiliates to take a loss on theses sites also.
http://www.casinoaffiliateprograms.c...ker.0152.html?
AP & UB present themselves as two different programs on CAP but they struggle to respond to the same questions, people keep asking for months.
Both sites have major tracking issues & its certainly no error. Its a scam, all the way through their business model. They will keep scamming until they fade out. Its a shame. They could have probably been up there with Stars if they hadnt just gone for the quick buck instead.
Some larger sites still push them (even after they knew about the internal cheating). Im sure they are getting paid a little extra but hopefully in the long run, karma will kick them in the ass.
Cheating mode
1) Player
2) Charity
3) Affiliate
4) Cheap shills
5) Failing to pay advertizers
I wonder if they ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: pokeraddict at January 20, 2008, 10:26 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote:
If you see any website advertising either one of these two cheating poker rooms... Don't support them, don't buy anything from them and don't use their links to register at any casinos....
Exactly. It is disgusting to see large affiliate portals still allowing this rogue group to be certified. One poker portal even tries to act like AP has completely fixed the situation and praises them for how they handled it. It is obviously pure greed and shows the only thing these groups care about is picking up sub affiliates. The only other excuse would be having little if any knowledge of the poker industry and thus being unable to comprehend how much the entire industry's reputation was hurt by AP/UB.
BonusWhores, Pokerlistings and family, Pocket 5's, 2+2 and of course CM are all portals that refuse AP advertising. These are among the bigger and more respected names in the industry.
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| Posted by: trambopoline at January 20, 2008, 9:53 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Hey, this is trambopoline from twoplustwo. I was the the one who made all of the original accusations. I got to say, I dont like that you labeled this as a 'false alarm.' This is anything but a false alarm. Just because I was tricked into believing that several of the emails were from Phil, that does not mean that this is not a case of several players clearly cheating on UB. If possible, please delete the emails that were confirmed to be fake and please change the title containing the words 'false alarm'. If you read all of the evidence against him and truly know all the facts of the case, its quite clear this is NOT a false alarm.
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| Posted by: lojo at January 14, 2008, 6:47 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by lots0
I've said it before and I'll say it again... Cheaters are cheaters.
Why would anyone with more than 1/2 brain think that UP and AP are different... because they have different names... they are both owned and operated by the same people... the cheaters.
Show the affiliates how you feel.
If you see any website advertising either one of these two cheating poker rooms... Don't support them, don't buy anything from them and don't use their links to register at any casinos....
And at least in the case of AP (and probably UB) please read post #3 here http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...ffiliates.html and decide what to do from there.
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| Posted by: lots0 at January 14, 2008, 6:44 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
I've said it before and I'll say it again... Cheaters are cheaters.
Why would anyone with more than 1/2 brain think that UP and AP are different... because they have different names... they are both owned and operated by the same people... the cheaters.
Show the affiliates how you feel.
If you see any website advertising either one of these two cheating poker rooms... Don't support them, don't buy anything from them and don't use their links to register at any casinos....
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| Posted by: KellyBlend at January 14, 2008, 6:22 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
2+2 Mods deleted false information in connection with Phil Hellmuth´s emails already. The threads are now relatively clean. But here in this forum we still have the wording of these emails. Please consider them as false information. Nevertheless, the UP story is still hot and it seems to be no false alarm.
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| Posted by: Casinomeister at January 14, 2008, 3:14 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by Komodo
Why exactly is the thread renamed to false alarm for?
Its pretty clear more cheating has been going on by at least nionio.
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...ad.php?t=99247
Because the OP said that he posted false information and requested that it be changed. Normally, I do not base anything off of what goes on at other websites - you need to be cautious and not jump to conclusions.
There are many 2+2 members registered here. If there are issues that need to be referred to Casinomeister, I'm sure they will start posting them here.
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| Posted by: Komodo at January 14, 2008, 3:09 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Why exactly is the thread renamed to false alarm for?
Its pretty clear more cheating has been going on by at least NioNio. Probably with help from ery high up...
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...ad.php?t=99247
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| Posted by: Zoozie at January 14, 2008, 1:49 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by jetset
From what I can see, however, this does not discredit the full allegations being made here and elsewhere that something is amiss at UltimateBet and needs looking into.
The data from 2+2 shows foul play, with almost as little doubt in the AP scandal. This time is it not 15 sigma, but only 10 sigma 'lucky'-streak, so still nothing that can be explained by logic.
So the renaming of the title to 'false alarm' is not correct. It is still utterly suspicious. Especially that the user somehow has been deleted now. (AP also did this to cover up).
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| Posted by: jetset at January 14, 2008, 1:35 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Strange how some folks get their kicks by cold-bloodedly seeking to discredit a poster by playing "red herring" tricks like this on him/her...but glad to see you addressed the flaw quickly and openly, realwtfsup.
From what I can see, however, this does not discredit the full allegations being made here and elsewhere that something is amiss at UltimateBet and needs looking into.
And if UB has launched an investigation, then presumably it has also informed the KGC (if they've learned anything at all from the Absolute Poker debacle) within 24 hours of the discovery.
This does not appear to have been satisfactorily cleared up yet....I for just one will watch developments with interest.
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| Posted by: realwtfsup at January 14, 2008, 12:59 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
So the emails ive been getting that I thought were Phil Hellmuth (I had good reasons to believe so) turned out to be some playing me like a fiddle, apparently ****ing with me for no good reason. What happend was I gave my email address to Phil while chatting with him at a table and there were hundreds of obvservers watching. I receieved about 8 different emails within the next 5 minutes and I was dumb enough to just assume that the screename I thought was Phil was actually phil. I guess the way he talked just seemed the most professional and I was convinced it was him. I kept in touch with this guy all day thinking it was actually Phil. I cant tell you how terrible I feel right now. I feel like my reputation has been tarnished but I want everyone to know, this was an honest mistake on my part. I didnt look enough into the info before I got all giddy and posted what I thought was a huge breakthrough.
Anyways after tracking down Phil at the tables I finally got a hold of him, this time for real... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Mousey at January 14, 2008, 12:43 pm | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Thanks for posting this. And thanks to the players who stuck to their guns to find the truth.
And now... thanks to AP and UB and the cheats, I'll be certain not to play poker anywhere online with my money. Ever.
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| Posted by: GaryWatson at January 14, 2008, 7:03 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Thanks nash, I can work the multi quote
Quote: Originally Posted by realwtfsup
Yeah! Thank god there are players out there who have the ability to find cheaters, colluders and bots.
The problem is, when a site like AP realises they are being watched, they only have to use a little common sense to avoid being caught the next time. A half decent player could have been cheating from day one and we would never know. They dont have to win every hand to clean up.
Quote: Originally Posted by jetset
I agree - the Absolute Poker ruling by the KGC has at least set a strong precedent that sites caught out will be required not only to pay punitive penalties, but also reimburse players who have been prejudiced by the cheating.
If they do not stick to that, they will at the ery least suffer damage to business and maybe sink (in retrospect - not a bad thought either for some of these enues!)
KGC is a joke. By their own proclaimed st... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: jetset at January 14, 2008, 6:41 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by pokeraddict
But think about how much money players got cheated out of by "good" cheats at AP/UB. I can't imagine all of the cheating has been uncovered. There could be many millions of dollars stolen by these fraudsters that will never be found. What I don't get is that Hellmuth says players may not recover those stolen funds. UB owes these players and if they don't pay them even people that for some reason still defend AP/UB will have ot come around and agree it's time to join the right side.
I agree - the Absolute Poker ruling by the KGC has at least set a strong precedent that sites caught out will be required not only to pay punitive penalties, but also reimburse players who have been prejudiced by the cheating.
If they do not stick to that, they will at the ery least suffer damage to business and maybe sink (in retrospect - not a bad thought either for some of these enues!)
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| Posted by: jetset at January 14, 2008, 6:36 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by realwtfsup
Yeah! Thank god there are players out there who have the ability to find cheaters, colluders and bots.
Never a truer word! And the fact that the player community has this capability to detect cheats should be a major deterrent for other crooked or ulnerable poker sites out there.....and so called regulatory and licensing jurisdictions who don't take their responsibilities to the players seriously.
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| Posted by: bb28 at January 14, 2008, 6:25 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by realwtfsup
Yeah! Thank god there are players out there who have the ability to find cheaters, colluders and bots.
You hit the nail on the head with that comment.
If it wasn't for them, people would just be blindly allowing their money to be stolen. I just hope that this makes more of a impact on online poker players more than the AP scandal seemed to. I was playing at 2 different sites recently and I mentioned the AP stuff in chat and can you believe.......hardly anyone knew about it.
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| Posted by: pokeraddict at January 14, 2008, 6:18 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by realwtfsup
Yeah! Thank god there are players out there who have the ability to find cheaters, colluders and bots.
But think about how much money players got cheated out of by "good" cheats at AP/UB. I can't imagine all of the cheating has been uncovered. There could be many millions of dollars stolen by these fraudsters that will never be found. What I don't get is that Hellmuth says players may not recover those stolen funds. UB owes these players and if they don't pay them even people that for some reason still defend AP/UB will have to come around and agree it's time to join the right side.
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| Posted by: realwtfsup at January 14, 2008, 6:13 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by bb28
This is just too much isn't it!
I used to play quite a bit of small stakes, but after the AP thing broke, I think I've made one deposit and I used to play at UB.
No more......how can any of the sites be trusted? I especially don't see how anyone playing with big stakes could put their faith in any site to be trustworthy and honest, after these two scandals. The official audit of AP.......seems to me that they were trying too hard not to step on any toes or ruffle any feathers.
Yeah! Thank god there are players out there who have the ability to find cheaters, colluders and bots.
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| Posted by: jetset at January 14, 2008, 5:47 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Whoa! this really is a shocker that will reverberate around the Internet and rightly disturb players everywhere....and it sounds as if initially UB is taking the same denial route (trying to get threads shut down etc) as its sister.
Presumably UB shares the same Joe Norton "ownership" and Kahnawake licensing as Absolute Poker, which makes it even worse for both parties, given KGC's report over the weekend and its truly frustrating lack of real, hard information.
There's no way this one can be swept under the carpet.
Gaming Associates must be licking their chops at the prospect of another well-paid investigation. And any hope Kahnawake may have had of persuading the UK Gambling Commission to add it to the whitelist has now surely fled.
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| Posted by: bb28 at January 14, 2008, 5:20 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
This is just too much isn't it!
I used to play quite a bit of small stakes, but after the AP thing broke, I think I've made one deposit and I used to play at UB.
No more......how can any of the sites be trusted? I especially don't see how anyone playing with big stakes could put their faith in any site to be trustworthy and honest, after these two scandals. The official audit of AP.......seems to me that they were trying too hard not to step on any toes or ruffle any feathers.
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| Posted by: pokeraddict at January 14, 2008, 5:17 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
I've been following this too. This is why it was a good idea to stop promoting and playing at UB too. These accusations have been floating around for quite some time but UB has been silent. It shows that AP has been lying all along too about being open about the fraud. Nobody should be shocked here. I wonder what is next.
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| Posted by: bb28 at January 14, 2008, 5:06 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Quote: Originally Posted by realwtfsup
Here is an email from Phil Hellmuth and link to thread from 2+2
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...ad.php?t=99247
I read part of the thread the other day on 2+2 but there wasn't any email from Hellmuth on there. I don't see it there now after doing a real quick look.
Never mind.......I found the post on 2+2. Maybe this link will take you directly to that page.
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...=99247&page=26
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| Posted by: realwtfsup at January 14, 2008, 4:46 am | | Topic: Ultimate Bet - superuser false alarm Forum: Casino Meister |
Here is an email from Phil Hellmuth and link to thread from 2+2
Okay before I call you.......I do have some information right now as I got off the phone with a "very high up". It does seem that there are several superuser accounts that UB has just mentioned to me. They were holding off on announcing it due to reasons I am unaware of, but apparently this is a new strand, like you suspected (and I doubted) of superusers, unlike with the AP scandal. I want to apologize, but keep in mind I was simply a "promotional" figure with them. This is an OFFSHORE company. Apparently it will be ery hard to persecute, just as with the AP scandal, since the money has already been withdrawn according to "Kushal" since this did occur several months ago. They are saying that it is most likely they will be UNABLE to retrieve those funds as involved in the dispute. If you have any further questions, follow up in this email, but give it some thought. Thanks for your understanding... | | Read Entire Entry |
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