| Posted by: Valhalla1 at June 27, 2005, 8:56 am | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | like someone posted, I would flat call the raise because you're either going to lose the maximum or win the minimum with a reraise on the flop. if there was a flush or straight draw I would re-raise however, esp. if I had a backdoor flush draw
on the subject of how my good hands are doing in NL- 20k hands, 14BB/100
sorted by net winnings it looks kinda weird
AA
QQ
AQo
KK
TT
AKo
by win % it looks more normal although my kings are still getting raped
AA
QQ
KK
AKs
AKo
JJ | | Static Link |
| Posted by: noidroid at June 26, 2005, 4:59 am | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | Cause this is NL, passive postflop play is not how you win money. And those are not the only two things your opponent can have, you could be up against TPTK or a lesser overpair. In a raised pot situation like this you need to decide if your hand is good on the flop or not, and raise or fold accordingly.
The true answer to this question has been said already: it depends. GT+ helps so much in NL ring games. Against some players you need to give them the benefit of the doubt, against others you need to stay aggressive and live with the consequences.
This is a very good topic though. My 3 biggest money winners for 40k hands of .5/1 NL are AA, KK, and QQ in that order. There really isn't a concrete guidline on how to play these hands, a lot of it is instinct(and if you don't have instinct, use GT+).
Or maybe just the law of averages..
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| Posted by: Drinking Bear at June 19, 2005, 6:09 pm | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | Why would you reraise in that situation? There are two likely possibilities: opponent has a set, or a middle pocket pair. If you reraise, you'll end up all in against a set, and you'll tell the middle pocket pair, "No, I really do have a better hand than you." You end up losing the maximum to a set, and letting a middle pair get away cheap.
Decide now whether he has a set or not, and either fold or get ready to play for your whole stack.
If you flat call, you represent a drawing hand like AK. That way, if the turn is a blank, the lower pocket pair will probably bet into you. | | Static Link |
| Posted by: hofdaddy at June 15, 2005, 1:07 pm | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | AstroFlop wrote: hofdaddy wrote: AstroFlop wrote: I concur totally. Your opponent has put you on a big ace, and thinks you'll raise post-flop regardless (which is actually a good way to play most of the time, since most people will fold under that pressure). Your aces are likely good, same with kings. I'm leary of pocket queens though after a reraise, but they're probably also good most of the time.
Let's face it: you're playing NL! You HAVE to be willing to risk your stack, especially with quality hands like that! Now get in there and drag those pots!!!
Truer words are rarely ever spoken!
Why thank you Hof! I feel quite complimented, especially coming from an uber-ho like yourself!
Your welcome. The game that we play, NL, is tough enough without overthinking every possible play. I feel if you are just starting out just dumb yourself down, cause as we all know, most players on these sites are not overthinking plays either. If they... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: AstroFlop at June 15, 2005, 10:40 am | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | hofdaddy wrote: AstroFlop wrote: I concur totally. Your opponent has put you on a big ace, and thinks you'll raise post-flop regardless (which is actually a good way to play most of the time, since most people will fold under that pressure). Your aces are likely good, same with kings. I'm leary of pocket queens though after a reraise, but they're probably also good most of the time.
Let's face it: you're playing NL! You HAVE to be willing to risk your stack, especially with quality hands like that! Now get in there and drag those pots!!!
Truer words are rarely ever spoken!
Why thank you Hof! I feel quite complimented, especially coming from an uber-ho like yourself!
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| Posted by: hofdaddy at June 14, 2005, 6:23 pm | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | AstroFlop wrote: I concur totally. Your opponent has put you on a big ace, and thinks you'll raise post-flop regardless (which is actually a good way to play most of the time, since most people will fold under that pressure). Your aces are likely good, same with kings. I'm leary of pocket queens though after a reraise, but they're probably also good most of the time.
Let's face it: you're playing NL! You HAVE to be willing to risk your stack, especially with quality hands like that! Now get in there and drag those pots!!!
Truer words are rarely ever spoken!
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| Posted by: macman at June 14, 2005, 2:08 pm | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | Very, very tough subject. I think the answer is, it depends. At lower NL levels ($25, $50); I've tended to play AA and KK ultra aggressive and over several hundred thousand hands, this has paid off as my stats show these as my two best moneymakers with respect to starting hands. I will slow down with KK if an ace flops however. By slowing down I mean, if first in, I'll generally make a pot sized bet on the flop regardless of what flops. If raised, I will generally fold. With AA, I'll make a pot sized bet unless it is a really, really scary board (I'm always leery when a pair flops, particularly if it is paint - it is amazing how many morons will call a 4x to 8x pfr with KQ, AJ, KJ AT, etc. - so if the flop is JJx, I am concerned) flops such as one suit (and one of my cards isn't the suit); 3 connectors, etc.. I also pay attention to how many callers I have. If one, I'm inclined to risk a lot of chips. For each extra caller preflop, the more cautious I am.
I play QQ a lot more cautious.... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: AstroFlop at June 14, 2005, 12:04 pm | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | I concur totally. Your opponent has put you on a big ace, and thinks you'll raise post-flop regardless (which is actually a good way to play most of the time, since most people will fold under that pressure). Your aces are likely good, same with kings. I'm leary of pocket queens though after a reraise, but they're probably also good most of the time.
Let's face it: you're playing NL! You HAVE to be willing to risk your stack, especially with quality hands like that! Now get in there and drag those pots!!!
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| Posted by: IceNine at June 13, 2005, 1:24 pm | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | here's what i see:
your 2/3 pot bet on the flop probably screamed AK to the guy, given that many players will fire again postflop with a slick when they miss, and it may have looked like that's what you were trying to take it down on a junk flop. He's responded by making anther smallish bet, probably trying to take the pot away from you. I would either raise the pot or go all in, depending on wether or not i'd have enough money left to pot it again on the turn. the times when he has a lower pocket pair, a draw, or a missed hand are going to outnumber the times that he's hit a set enough to make this play profitable. | | Static Link |
| Posted by: hofdaddy at June 13, 2005, 1:18 pm | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | Gr8Swede wrote: Hi, I need some help from you people who plays NL
I am having BIG BIG trouble folding AA, KK, QQ after the flop.
If I raise 4-5* BB preflop full ring table and 2 people calls and the flop is 2 6 8 No two suited cards.
Lets say the pot is 12$ after flop, I then raise 8$ with AA, KK, QQ. And suddenly someone re raise me for like 15$. Should I fold,and put him/her on set ?It is hard for me.
If I only call he/she will raise after the turn again and then I most likely would be pot commited.
Should I re raise again with AA and fold KK, QQ he could be having JJ and put me on AK.
Thank you for giving me an advice.
Your hand is goot. Reraise and take down the pot. It's amazing what you will see people raise a pot with. Take a chance and if you win congrats and note it. If you lose knock the table and say "nh" and note it
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| Posted by: Yakface at June 13, 2005, 10:17 am | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | Virtually impossible to answer. Too many variables.
The only hope you've really got is in assessing the player rather than the board - LAG/maniac call or raise. Tight arse start to consider you are up against aces/set If you don't know anything about them then there is no magic advice anyone can give you that will stop you losing your shirt sometimes - when two people have overpairs, it's often trouble for one of them with a low board.
Full ring there is roughly a 1 in 24 chance your kings are up against aces , 1 in 12 your queens are facing a higher over pair etc. Each player has a 0.7% of having a pair corresponding to one of the three cards on the board - and that's only if they woud see your bet with a pair of two's. I can't really see someone having two pair - calling a bet of 10 on a $1/2 table with 86 suited and very few players.......but anything is possible - I lost $200 on aces to 45 of hearts recently, when a 4 and a 5 hit on the flop. Just me him and one other in, I had... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: FeelingLucky at June 13, 2005, 9:11 am | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | | Don't take my word for it though - since the player raising you is also a no-limit player, his reasoning behind putting in that raise may be completely different than the limit players that raise my KK on a 852 flop with just a small pair... | | Static Link |
| Posted by: Gr8Swede at June 13, 2005, 9:04 am | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | Thanks for your answer.
If i reraise the reraise its probably better to go all in so i dont have to do any more guessing on the turn and the river.
But if do that with QQ against AA it will cost me my stack or even with AA against a set. But i dont have to do any more guessing about his hand.
So hopefully you win more often than you loose thoose situations. | | Static Link |
| Posted by: FeelingLucky at June 13, 2005, 8:33 am | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | Can't speak for no limit, so this may or may not apply. Still - in limit, I find that people (including myself) often push/raise the preflop raisor on a flop like you described. And they do this, the majority of the time, because they assume the raisor has a high, unpaired hand (AK, AQ, AJ) and has missed the flop completely.
There is a statistical point to that, since there are so many more possible combinations of AK, AQ etc than there are high (say TT+) pocket pair combinations. So to me, the raise on the flop usually means they have hit a pair on the flop, or that they have a small pocket pair. I have also found several occasions where they have nothing (could be like KQ or something) and hope to scare you out of the pot because they think you did not hit.
So, in limit, I have started to either reraise them right there on the flop and then keep betting the turn and river, or (to mix it up) I back down on the flop and just call, let them continue the semi-bluff on the turn, and raise ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Gr8Swede at June 13, 2005, 5:16 am | | Topic: Folding the big ones Forum: Bonus Whores | Hi, I need some help from you people who plays NL
I am having BIG BIG trouble folding AA, KK, QQ after the flop.
If I raise 4-5* BB preflop full ring table and 2 people calls and the flop is 2 6 8 No two suited cards.
Lets say the pot is 12$ after flop, I then raise 8$ with AA, KK, QQ. And suddenly someone re raise me for like 15$. Should I fold,and put him/her on set ?It is hard for me.
If I only call he/she will raise after the turn again and then I most likely would be pot commited.
Should I re raise again with AA and fold KK, QQ he could be having JJ and put me on AK.
Thank you for giving me an advice. | | Static Link |
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