| Posted by: HeelHo at November 8, 2005, 5:01 pm | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | If youre going to do this for your income.............you need to decide between two things. The absofucking boredom of playing off 3-4k a month in bonuses
plus a small profit vs the stress of big play. You can do what I do and make it ABC poker on 8-12 tables, or you can try to win it yourself. I think Ive maxed the income potential for non gnome, non signup low limit whoring. I can manage about 6-7k/month that way with some time left over for casinos, arbitrage, and wanking. I dont know what the bigger players clear in a month doing 5/10 or NL 400. Thats about the level Id expect to make up for the difference in playing as many tables for the bonus as you can keep a positive expecation at versus playing less tables for a bigger hourly win rate.
(I dont know anyone doing 12 tables at those limits, if so he can be my new goddess).
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And a bayonet, sir, with som... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Mikke_ at November 7, 2005, 10:29 pm | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | RobDoral wrote: DrStrange wrote: After some reflection, I realized I was full of petunias. The existance of the bonus should profoundly affect our play. The bonus represents over half of the income for a good player and 80% or more of the income for an average or poor player.
Assuming you do not have enough time to take advantage of all the bonuses offered each month, the bonus drives you to make choices about level and numbers of hands that would be -ev absent the bonus. Clearly you are better off playing above your level or playing more tables even if it means your poker income rate due to skill per 100 hands is degraded because you will clear the bonus money faster.
Given the bonus situation for the part time whore it is clear we should be playing higher and/or playing more tables even if the result is a significant loss of skill based income.
Might still be full of petunias. Bonuses may profoundly affect a bonus whore's results but it shouldn't af... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Mikke_ at November 7, 2005, 10:19 pm | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | DrStrange wrote: After some reflection, I realized I was full of petunias. The existance of the bonus should profoundly affect our play. The bonus represents over half of the income for a good player and 80% or more of the income for an average or poor player.
DrStrange
I for one would like to become a player where the bonus is only a small part of my income. So far it is helping to build my bankroll. If the future is that the bonus is only half of my potential income then I would give up this quest right now.
The learning curve continues....... | | Static Link |
| Posted by: peritonlogon at November 7, 2005, 9:55 pm | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | One time that it might make a serious difference in how you play is if you find one of those few bonuses and few games within those few bonuses where you can have +EV without winning, or rather playing anything.
In other words, only fold yields $$$$
And you risk $000000.00
When this happens [i]and[/i] you either don't feel like or aren't able to risk any money then you should change your play style immediately, to only fold.
Then the $ you make is directly proportional to the amout of time, tables and size of the bonus. | | Static Link |
| Posted by: peritonlogon at November 7, 2005, 9:54 pm | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | One time that it might make a serious difference in how you play is if you find one of those few bonuses and few games within those few bonuses where you can have +EV without winning, or rather playing anything.
In other words, only fold yields $$$$
And you risk $000000.00
When this happens [i]and[/i] you either don't feel like or aren't able to risk any money then you should change your play style immediately, to only fold.
Then the $ you make is directly proportional to the amout of time, tables and size of the bonus.[/i] | | Static Link |
| Posted by: JPMcMoney at November 5, 2005, 12:02 pm | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | | Bonus whoring should NEVER dictate how you play. It is bad for your game. Here is an example. At Poker Stars, everyone knows that the bonus clears faster playing NL200 vs. NL100. Same can be said for NL400 vs. NL200. Now, I have played at all 3 levels when clearing a bonus. Conventional wisdom would tell me "play the NL400 all the time, you'll clear the bonus faster". That may be true, but if the NL200 or NL100 games are much juicier and full of weaker players than the NL400 in a given session and I know I can make much more money playing there, bonus be damned, that's where I am playing. I go where the BEST game is. Period. It might take a little longer to clear the bonus, but my OVERALL rate of return will definitely be higher in the long run. If the game is good at NL400, fine, I'll play that. But it's the level and bonus clearing rate is not my main driver for table selection, that's for sure. All the bonus does for me is make the losing sessions a little less painful, that's about that. It... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: FeelingLucky at November 5, 2005, 9:29 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | DrStrange wrote: I have attached tables for bonuses with clearing rates ranging from 5X to 20X and a table for no bonus. I have compaired three levels of games at four different $/100BB rates. It was a huge eye opener for me...
5X bonus - income rates per 100 hands
Assume that 2/4 rakes 85%; 1/2 rakes 65%; 0.5/1 rakes 35%
Does $2/4 really rake anywhere CLOSE to 85% at most places? I thought most poker sites rakes $1/2 hands around $5 pots, while $2/4 often requires $20 pots...
What are these assumptions based on? | | Static Link |
| Posted by: xedubx at November 4, 2005, 3:31 pm | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | RobDoral wrote:
I'm also not sure I agree that half a good player's income comes from a bonus (though I know where you came up with this figure). As limits get higher, the bonus counts for less and less of one's total winnings. If a player wins 1bb/100 and makes the equivalent of another 1bb/100 in bonus, sure, that's half, but as badly as some people play online, rates of 2bb/100 or higher are sustainable imo at levels where the bonus never comes close to .5bb/100.
But I do agree that bonuses probably account for a lot more profit than many whore's realize and I even think multitabling to clear bonuses more efficiently may force whores who would otherwise play bad poker to play more solid, disciplined poker because they just don't have time to make bad decisions (like chasing a small pair that doesn't hit a set on the flop).
I agree. It basically depends on the limit you play and how much of a bonus chaser you are. My priority always has been finding good games over b... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Osric at November 4, 2005, 11:27 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | First, lets get our terminology right. You are not bonus CHASING, you are bonus WHORING. Come on...say it...you are a whore. All together now, "WE ARE WHORES!"
Next, play your best game...always. Whether you are playing for a bonus that takes 5x hands to clear or 20x. Play your best game. Bonuses will add to your wins, or pad your losses.
Then, get used to streaks. You will have awesome months, and you will have months that you LOSE money even AFTER the bonuses. No big deal. Aces get cracked. AK loses to A2 (had that happen to me when a duck hit the river busting my trips.) It is one big long poker game. I've never heard of anyone not losing at some point. 100BB losing sessions will happen, although not nearly as often as 25-50BB losing sessions. | | Static Link |
| Posted by: RobDoral at November 4, 2005, 8:57 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | DrStrange wrote: After some reflection, I realized I was full of petunias. The existance of the bonus should profoundly affect our play. The bonus represents over half of the income for a good player and 80% or more of the income for an average or poor player.
Assuming you do not have enough time to take advantage of all the bonuses offered each month, the bonus drives you to make choices about level and numbers of hands that would be -ev absent the bonus. Clearly you are better off playing above your level or playing more tables even if it means your poker income rate due to skill per 100 hands is degraded because you will clear the bonus money faster.
Given the bonus situation for the part time whore it is clear we should be playing higher and/or playing more tables even if the result is a significant loss of skill based income.
Might still be full of petunias. Bonuses may profoundly affect a bonus whore's results but it shouldn't affect the way they play. ... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: DrStrange at November 4, 2005, 7:17 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | After some reflection, I realized I was full of petunias. The existance of the bonus should profoundly affect our play. The bonus represents over half of the income for a good player and 80% or more of the income for an average or poor player.
Assuming you do not have enough time to take advantage of all the bonuses offered each month, the bonus drives you to make choices about level and numbers of hands that would be -ev absent the bonus. Clearly you are better off playing above your level or playing more tables even if it means your poker income rate due to skill per 100 hands is degraded because you will clear the bonus money faster.
I have attached tables for bonuses with clearing rates ranging from 5X to 20X and a table for no bonus. I have compaired three levels of games at four different $/100BB rates. It was a huge eye opener for me.
Given the bonus situation for the part time whore it is clear we should be playing higher and/or playing more tables even if the r... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: RobDoral at November 3, 2005, 7:56 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | CheeseBurger wrote: I play like there is no bonus. I just use the bonus money as a saftey net. If you are playing poker, the goal has to be to play better poker.
Couldn't agree more, I treat bonuses exactly the same way. I usually make more money playing good poker than I get from the bonuses but I almost always play with a bonus to clear so that if I hit a bad run it works as form of variance insulation.
It's easy to tell yourself that if you play good poker you'll win in the long run but when your bankroll starts to shrink it's hard not to panic a little and having that cushion really helps because if you do start to play scared you'll really start to see that bankroll shrink fast (not that dropping down a limit or taking some time to plug leaks in your game aren't good ideas too). For player's that need some work on their game or who are learning a new one a bonus can also cushion the learning curve a bit (e.g. when I started to play L08 as a change of pace I was damn gl... | | Read Entire Entry |
| Posted by: Grinder at November 3, 2005, 6:06 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | Quote: 7) If your annoyed alot, find a new hobby
Hell - I'm ALWAYS annoyed. Problem is playing CIV4 won't make me $14K a year.
Don't worry about bonus so much - just play good poker.
Most players are actually -EV trying to get a bonus at 1/2 and would make more money in 2/4. | | Static Link |
| Posted by: ncullen at November 3, 2005, 2:07 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | Concentrate on the game and forget about the bonuses. Not making your draws and losing top pair happens; it is part of the game. Stop stressing about it and concentrate on important things:
1) Avoid pissing matches
2) Value bet the loose and predictable players
3) Protect your hand
4) Move when tables dry up
5) Move when your position isnt to your liking
6) Take a break whenever you are annoyed that AA lost
7) If your annoyed alot, find a new hobby
Read a book on odds | | Static Link |
| Posted by: xedubx at November 3, 2005, 12:49 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | briton wrote:
My question is this. How does Bonus chasing change your strategy? Should i be folding more hands and just collecting bonus? Or should i play normal and risk loosing a bunch of bad beats and not making ANYTHING on the bonus? I am actualy on track to loose money on this bonus!
None whatsoever. Just play your best poker. My cards are running bad as well (-1K last 2 days) but that's just part of the negative variance. There are going to be times that you lose money on a bonus (and much, much more as you move up on limit) even if you are the greatest thing since Phil Ivey but that's something you need to be able to handle if you are going to continue playing.
Also, since you are starting out, you might want to pay extra attention to holes in your game as well as try to improve your game. Anyone can be succesful for a month or even 3 or 4 months, but that doesn't mean you are a +EV player.
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| Posted by: CheeseBurger at November 3, 2005, 12:33 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | I play like there is no bonus. I just use the bonus money as a saftey net. If you are playing poker, the goal has to be to play better poker. Once you start to focusing on only the bonus your learning curve will flatten out.
bonus money = pull up diapers | | Static Link |
| Posted by: DrStrange at November 3, 2005, 12:03 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | Play winning poker. The bonuses will allow you to build your bank roll faster, or if you lose, lose someone else's money. Use Poker Tracker and study your play after each session. Do not play just to win the bonus - learn to win at poker.
my $0.02
DrStrange | | Static Link |
| Posted by: Somescum at November 3, 2005, 12:00 am | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | | It's obvious that you should play what you think is the best poker, suiting the specific table and players. It has nothing to do with bonus. Bonus is just bonus, a little something extra on the side (that increases your EV). | | Static Link |
| Posted by: briton at November 2, 2005, 11:49 pm | | Topic: How does bonus chasing change your play strategy? Forum: Bonus Whores | Hello! I am very excited about bonus chasing and am learning every day. I have turned a 600$ bankroll into a 1100$ bankroll in the month of October. However this week I have been suffering terrible. I am missing all my draws and AA KK and QQ are never making a winning pot for me. My AA is always getting beat by 10 4o. just a few minutes ago I hit 2small pair on the big blind and of course get beat by trips. I cant win a hand. its like the cards are stacked. I am actually clearing my Holloween Paradise bonus and LOOSING MONEY on a very nice bonus! THIS SUCKS. 10 minutes ago i raised with AK and got beat by A10 on the river. If i get AA i loose. Nothing is going rite this week.
My question is this. How does Bonus chasing change your strategy? Should i be folding more hands and just collecting bonus? Or should i play normal and risk loosing a bunch of bad beats and not making ANYTHING on the bonus? I am actualy on track to loose money on this bonus! I am tired of raising with quallity hands and miss... | | Read Entire Entry |
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